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gsplover Houston, Tx.
 MH Posts:382


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| 09/23/2012 3:55 AM |
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Hi. We have had a new developement....well sort of new. My 75 pound male GSP that we got from our breeder at the age of 7 months has always been cautious around new people brought into the house, or ANY men in uniform. At the dog park, or out on walks, he is not bothered by anyone and in fact, will go up to anyone for a petting or belly rub. Recently, however, he has started barking a series of fast woofs and charging people that walk into our house and jumping up on them as he's barking. The people know him to be a kind, non-biting dog, so they remain calm and just push him off. Last week, my husband and I were on a bike ride and we saw a male neighbor from down the street. We stopped to talk. When our neighbor (who Kaido did not know), started approaching, Kaido began barking that fast woof, woof, woof, woof, and lunged forward. I corrected Kaido, and asked my neighbor not to make eye contact or to talk to Kaido. Within about a minute, Kaido slowly moved towards him for a sniff, and then put his head under our neighbors hand for a pet! What in the world? He has never bitten, nor does he try to bite. He will stop when we tell him to. Last week, my daughter's boyfriend visited from college, and Kaido acted like he had never seen him before, barked, charged, and jumped up on him, barking close to his ear. All these charges have been sudden and completely unprovoked. He used to bark at some men on walks, but it wasn't bad. I admit, it has been awhile, 5 or 6 weeks since we have taken him to the dog park, or on long walks because of his long haitus with the broken toe. He is back in commission, but SO in need of REAL exercise, that we have been biking with him instead of walking with him. Is he de-socialized now? Is this something I should worry about? Will he stop this behavior if we take him for walks with lots of people around? He is SUPER sweet and a BIG chicken for the most part. However, when it comes to semi-strangers coming to our house, he's not afraid to act like he's not afraid to protect us. There is a part of me that wants to nip it NOW and scold him for doing this, but there is a part of me that WANTS him to remain protective. My 17 year old daughter often takes him for bike rides with her at night when it's cooler, and I WANT him to protect her if someone tries to move in on her. However, I want him to learn when it's okay and when it's not okay. I don't want him doing this with friends! They don't appreciate it. This is an entirely new experience for me. I have never had a dog before that did anything but wag a tail and drop on the floor for a belly rub. This is a bit disturbing to me. I trust my breeder, I don't think he was ever abused, but why is he doing this? When we first brought him home, he was terrified of my husband. He barked and barked and would not go close. I called the breeder and told her and she was clueless. I took him to the dog park, and when on leash, he would bark at men that were sitting down on park benches, but off leash in the dog park, he would go up to men and sit next to them for a pet. He warmed up quickly, within 3 or 4 days with my husband. I instructed my husband to feed him treats and take him for walks. That was it! Kaido is IN LOVE with my husband now! Just confused. I have read stories and talked to many GSP owners that say that some GSP's by nature are just more cautious as well as curious. My breeder is female so I just thought he was cautious around men because he was never really around men, but my breeder said Kaido was around male clients all the time and never had a problem. Anyway, just interested in what others have to say. Kaido is only a year. Just turned a year on the 20th.... Too young to be acting like this. |
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"He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion." -- Unknown |
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Texas Belle Austin, TX
 MH Posts:7843


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| 09/23/2012 11:04 AM |
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No not too young to be acting like that. Dogs will be protective of their house and their people and when someone they don't know or recognize comes in they will alert. Same thing when on leash because they do not have the flight option. It sounds to me like Kaido is uncertain about what he is supposed to do. I would setup a routine with him when someone comes over that let's him know everything is ok. I would make him sit when someone comes in while you greet that person. After the greetings are over and that initial excitement has passed he can more calmly greet the newcomers. I would work this on leash at first and maybe enlist some folks to help. You have to reinforce the sit and reward what you want him doing. I would not fuss at him for the barking, but let him know that the newcomer is a friend. He needs to know that you are in control and he is not needed to help. Mine will alert when someone is coming up to the door, but as soon as I come and check it out and tell them that it is our friend, they quiet down. I want them to let me know when there is someone strange around and they do. I also want those strangers to be aware of the dogs since I live alone. I can also tell the difference in their bark from the ecstatic bark when my mom and dad or my nephews are at the door and when it is someone they do not recognize. Also keep in mind things like coats, hats, glasses, dark clothes, etc will sometimes scare them a little even when it is on someone they know and until they pick up the scent of that person they may be tentative. My mother had a dog that would bark at my husband whenever he wore a dark coat until she got his scent or heard him speak and then she was all over him because she was crazy about him. |
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Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)
Yellow Rose GSPs
"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato |
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Smylinacha Connecticut
 MH Posts:1208


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| 09/23/2012 2:15 PM |
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| Ours bark and protect us at home too. They don't go after people during our walks but if a stranger comes to our house they are very protective. They do not like the FedEx or UPS man and they don't like it when my husband goes out the door with his motorcycle helmet on - they get all freaked out. Hard to calm them down too but they do in time. I don't mind it but they will freak out over more than people - any critter that is in the yard and if they hear a cat fight in the woods they get all antsy. We can't even leave the windows open at night because all the creatures in the woods start to stir and they'll be up all night barking. And car horns on TV - Windsor goes nuts and starts growling and then a bark fest. |
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pixie bee
 MH Posts:4450


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| 09/23/2012 2:23 PM |
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Your breeder does share the responsibility for your dog's behavior,along with the living environment. Your dog is insecure and reacting to a non threatening situation as though it is - your dog is percieving a threat. This starts in the womb (geneitc) and reinforced by the dam in the whelping box and further brought out by the environment - usually unknown to the owners. A good start to controlling the behavior is to be prepared for it and stop it before it starts. If your dog beleives you will protect him he won't feel the nned to protect himself and you. Essentially, your dog feels the need to become pack protector/leader b/c he believes no one ese will do the job. |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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gsplover Houston, Tx.
 MH Posts:382


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| 09/23/2012 11:40 PM |
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| Thank you all for your stories and suggestions. I will try them out. I have a lot of neighbors who will be willing to help me out! I am also going to start regular walks again on trails with a lot of people, and will see how it goes. Thanks! |
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"He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion." -- Unknown |
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Rose
 MH Posts:362

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| 09/24/2012 10:14 AM |
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There is a part of me that wants to nip it NOW and scold him for doing this, but there is a part of me that WANTS him to remain protective. My 17 year old daughter often takes him for bike rides with her at night when it's cooler, and I WANT him to protect her if someone tries to move in on her.
My own experience - dogs cannot differentiate which strangers are good/bad.
It is good that you recognize this early, there is a lot that can be done to prevent a situation like mine.
I second the fear/insecurity. Obedience (aka self control for the dog), and exposure to people in safe environments helps.
What we do:
1. We allow Casey to bark once. This alerts us that someone is at the door. After he is called away and put in a down-stay (beside someone to correct if needed), or put in a room. Then we check out the door & greets the stranger. We never allow Casey to be the first to greet the stranger. He is not released from the stay, or the room, until he is calm.
Door greetings for us take longer. The person on the outside can wait. And so they should. We have beware of dog signs.
2. We do training sessions where husband, or myself, goes outside and knocks on the door. We practice the above routine. Or if his tuck pulls up and I know he is coming in, I use it as another opportunity.
3. In get togethers, people are alerted to not make eye contact or to talk/touch Casey. I hand treats out to some people, and they are allowed to give him treats and light pet if Casey approaches them in a friendly/non pushy manner.
It is common for Casey to first bark at a stranger, and later on, once we show trust and conversation towards the stranger - warm up, sniff the stranger, and enjoy petting.
Our mentality: It is my job to protect our dogs, not the other way around. |
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gsplover Houston, Tx.
 MH Posts:382


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| 09/24/2012 10:57 AM |
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Thank you, Rose for your detail answer. Yes, you are correct. I definitely do NOT want Kaido to bite anyone. He minds well, and stops when we tell him, but these two occurences caught us so off guard. Now, however, as you said, we are aware of the situation. We watched Cesar Milan almost religiously when he was on, and still watch some of the reruns. We are very well aware of pack leader mentality. It's very strange because Kaido is the most submissive out of our 4, both to strangers and other dogs.....unless the dog weighs 3 pounds and yelps, then it's game on! This charging and barking ritual has only happened twice, and is something that is totally new from Kaido, (within the last 2 weeks new.) The ONLY hint that this behavior might begin was his caution and barking at SOME men. We have his littermate, sister who shares none of his characteristics. She doesn't bark at all. However, she is very sure of herself, and not scared of anything. She looks at the world as a big toybox and is curious about EVERYTHING. He is curious, but in a timid and cautious way around EVERYTHING. He gets cautious or unsure and will bark at a box in my closet if it's new! I would not call him "fearful" as he never cowers, slinks away, or avoids situations. He is a bit cautious, a bit unsure, but his curiousity (thank God for the curiosity!) gets the better of him. When we were at the dog park, off leash, he was pleasantly submissive around dogs, but curious and a bit too playful, borderling playing with his "prey" with the very small dogs, but we were able to put him in a sit and down very easily. I am definitely planning some exercises over the next few weeks with people coming to the door, and people out on a walk and while on the bike. Ohh, and we also have beware of dog signs, but never thought we would actually have to mean it! Thanks again for all your advice.
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"He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion." -- Unknown |
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therozypozy
 MH Posts:470


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| 09/24/2012 11:08 AM |
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Unfortunately I don't think you can have it both ways, a protective dog and one that will not bite someone as they cannot always tell who is threatening and who is not.
My older GSP used to charge anyone who was alone. For some reason that just got her going to see a person walking alone. Groups of people she did not respond to, just when someone was by themselves. This had to stop especially when she charged the neighbor when he was just out in his front yard. I was able to call her off, but what if I had not been paying close enough attention? She was pretty scary looking. So I ultimately used the e-collar. She was used to the ecollar before this and I found no other way to control her sudden outburst. I do not recommend this unless you know how to use one, but it has certainly worked for her. I had to set up her up for failure, but it did not take her long to get the idea.
She is still pretty protective at the house, but now she is taught to pick up something. She will find anything, usually my husband's shoe as they always seem to be at the door, but sometimes it could just be a stick outside. Pretty hard to bite if you have something in your mouth. But now she settles down quickly and it is more of just an alert that someone is there.
I have also been successful in getting all 4 of my dogs not to bark when people with or without dogs are walking down the street. We live in the city and people are always walking around that area to get to the lakefront. This was done with positive reinforcement . . . ie a cookie everytime someone was walking down the street and then ultimately, if you bark, you go inside. Like others said you have to stop it before they are going to start the behavior. It can take some time, but no doubt it can be fixed and should be. Because you do not want them to bite someone. Here in Louisiana they are quarantined if they bite a person and it is labled as a vicious dog. It is a three strikes and the dog can be euthinized, even if the bite is not serious. This can cause issues with your homeowner's insurance canceling on you.
Now when she is away from home, she is very well behaved with people and dogs. And if you have cookie, no doubt you are an immediate best friend.
Roz |
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Rose
 MH Posts:362

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| 09/24/2012 2:01 PM |
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My dog learned barking keeps fearful things away. This may have been conditioned, example - postman comes - dog barks - postman goes away.
Mine will skitter away from houseplants, tables, boxes that he bumps into. I see this as him lacking trust in environment, or self within environment. He most definitely prefers a submissive role versus the protector.
I choose to recognize his fear & insecurity. By doing so I can then modify(train) behavior. I can't change his past or breeding, but can change the now.
I believe my dog wishes to be friends with dogs/people, but doesn't know how. That's why I'm here to teach him.
Another key action that helps: We place our selves between him and the stranger.
He thought I was magical using this above method.
Our dog saw a stranger walking slowly down the street, and he barked, on guard. I chose to walk out infront of the dog, onto the driveway. I faced the stranger, and waited until the person walked past, then turned around. Our dog thought that my presence made the stranger go away. He showed immediate relief and lied down peacefully.
Cesar is great, love that guy. It's good that you have his sister there as a calm example. It's even better that you notice this early.
I find that beware of dogs signs are great at keeping theives and canvassers away too.
@ Roz, I did not realize it can affect insurance. Very good to know. |
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gsplover Houston, Tx.
 MH Posts:382


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| 09/25/2012 1:37 AM |
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Thank you SO much to ALL. I am getting FANTASTIC thoughts and suggestions from everyone, and have been able to apply the techniques. I called my neighbor while the dogs were playing outside, and asked her to come over. This is the SAME neighbor Kaido charged, barked and jumped on the other day. She was gracious enough to be a part of his rehab! (thank goodness!) Anyway, while the dogs were playing I gave her a handful of kibble treats and walked her into the back yard, (figured it was safer than in the house to start.) We just talked until he noticed her. He was chasing a bat that was flying overhead and didn't notice her for a good 5 minutes. I didn't call him over, I let him discover her presence. He came over and was SO polite. He didn't bark once, and his nose immediately smelled the treat so he made excellent eye contact with her but stayed calm. I commanded him to sit, (probably should have let him reach submissive himself.) He sat IMMEDIATELY. She started handing out the treats! He NEVER barked once! I hope that those two times just caught him off guard and were a fluke, however, they happened, so they MUST be dealt with. Tomorrow, we are going to try to have her knock on the door and practice the same techniques ya'll described. Thanks so much. I will keep you posted on new developments. Thank you again, and I welcome any and all suggestions! |
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"He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion." -- Unknown |
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