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Subject: Frozen Quail
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TessaGAUser is Offline
Georgia
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03/24/2010 9:45 AM  

I have a quail in my freezer from the last training day. Other than eating it, how should we use it?

 


To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
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jlp8cornellUser is Offline
Ithaca NY
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03/24/2010 9:52 AM  
Whole quail? I use them and pigeons for water retrieves. Also, could use for a drag track. I use the wings to get Max motivated and excited in obedience training (although some of my training buddies think that's gross!).

Jen
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=2440
Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
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03/24/2010 10:45 AM  
Tessa I have about a half dozen in the freezer. I use them for retrieving. Not good for planting and pointing as they don't smell the same. I also use the wings as motivators (obedience and conformation) although mine go over top for the wings. As Jen said you could use them for tracks and water retrieves too.

Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
bravepointUser is Offline
North Gower, ON Canada
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03/24/2010 1:38 PM  
I use them for retrieving practice.

When you use the wings for motivation in other venues, what do you do with them exactly?

Gail, Moka, Avery, Terra & Rayne
Bravepoint GSPs
Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
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03/24/2010 4:04 PM  
I use them the same as a toy for obedience and conformation. Mostly just to tease and get them excited.

Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
bravepointUser is Offline
North Gower, ON Canada
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03/24/2010 4:11 PM  
Thanks, Bev. I use lots of toys, tugs, frisbees etc in my training for agility and obedience. I guess that I hesitate to use a bird wing as I don't want the dogs to tug with it. Many of my field only GSP owner friends are horrified that I use tug toys with my dogs. So far, I've never had the behaviour carry over to a field retrieve with a bird.

Gail, Moka, Avery, Terra & Rayne
Bravepoint GSPs
zodiakgspsUser is Offline
NW PA
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03/24/2010 5:45 PM  
I tried wings in the ring & mine dont care about them, want a live one, LOL!! (not sure that would go over well at a show, a live quail in the ring???)
I find quail sink easy, I just use them for retrieving work in the yard & use pigeons/ducks for water work.
DesertRoseKennelUser is Offline

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03/24/2010 6:27 PM  

I like to play what I've nicknamed the "Dead Bird Game". I'll hide the ones I have in the yard - even one will work but I like to have 2-6 to use. I hide them when the dog is out of sight. Then I bring the dog out and give them no direction other than "Dead Bird, Gretchen!" (or whichever dog). I say it in an excited tone of voice and get the dog riled up and running around. The first time, they of course have no idea what you want them to do, but if you get them moving around the yard, they will usually find a bird. Hopefully they'll pick it up and retrieve it to you, and of course you act like this is the most wonderful thing any dog has ever done. Repeat this frequently and pretty soon, all it takes is for you to say "DEAD BIRD" and everyone's nose hits the ground and they start patterning and searching. This is of course helpful in hunting wild birds, but I have found it invaluable in field trials and hunt tests when the dogs have to make blind retrieves. Instead of the dog being lost as to what to do when they couldn't mark a bird going down, they have learned that this command means they should just put their nose down and search methodically. Has saved us MANY times when other dogs may have failed to retrieve. Plus it's just a fun game.

Jean


"Our dogs are bred to be champion hunters who sleep on the bed"
www.desertrosekennel.com
TessaGAUser is Offline
Georgia
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03/25/2010 6:21 AM  
Jean: Tessa knows the "dead" command. I use it for her to find quail-scented tennis balls - or any tennis ball, really - that was lost with neither one of us knowing where it is. The minute I say "dead" she starts searching, and loves it. Once she finds it, she always brings it right back. Would be nice to swap the dead ball for a dead bird. I figure the bird smells much different now but at least it will be closer to the real thing (in weight and texture) than a tennis ball...right? When you use the dead bird, is it still frozen, thawed or freshly dead?

Zodiak: They do sink, don't they? One time Tessa was swimming across a pond then all of a sudden started pumping water frantically circling. I thought she got entangled in something. After a while she dove and came up with a quail. I assume she picked up on the smell that hovered in the air above the water?

Bev: Yeah, she gets very excited about wings. I used some yesterday to tempt her out of a whoa... now a stupid question...argh...how do you get the wings off the bird - just break them off?

Question: Can you put quail scent on a dead quail before using it for a drag? Or would that really mess things up (because I am sure the dog picks up both scents)?

Another question: Last weekend after all the birds had been hunted up, I placed the dead quail in the field for her to find. It had been dead for about an hour. She pointed it - I am pretty sure by scent. I used this to whoa her a bit before picking up the quail. Was that a mistake? Should there have been the reward of the bird? I didn't want her to grab it and run off or pluck at it. Didn't have the check cord on her. Felt a little bit at a loss - been having a few "okay what now" moments lately ...

To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
My creation
DesertRoseKennelUser is Offline

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03/25/2010 7:04 AM  

Dead bird can be played with freshly dead, frozen or thawed. My dogs will find them any of those ways. I'm sure the scent degrades as they are thawed, but a bird is a bird.

As for when she found and pointed the dead bird, you didn't make any terrible mistake, but when I play that game, I want the dog to retrieve. Will she retrieve for you?

Jean


"Our dogs are bred to be champion hunters who sleep on the bed"
www.desertrosekennel.com
DesertRoseKennelUser is Offline

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03/25/2010 7:09 AM  

p.s. the other benefit of the game is exactly what you saw. It's very common, especially with a young dog, for them to find a dead bird and re-point it. In a hunt test or field trial, it often happens that a bird is shot (might be winged and alive, might be dead) and the dog will go out and re-point when sent for a retrieve. Now you have a problem. You can't walk up to encourage that dog to give up on the point and retrieve. This game helps to create a conditioned response that when you say "Dead Bird!" the dog knows they are supposed to grab the bird up and retrieve. Has saved us from failing many times.

Jean


"Our dogs are bred to be champion hunters who sleep on the bed"
www.desertrosekennel.com
TessaGAUser is Offline
Georgia
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Posts:2387


03/25/2010 7:11 AM  

No she does not retrieve reliably in the field (have not worked on it much, so my bad). That's why I didn't want to give the fetch command without being able to enforce it.


To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
My creation
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Forums > General > Training > Frozen Quail



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