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pixie bee
MH
Posts:4476
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| 06/19/2009 8:20 AM |
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Bev,
in your website thread you mentioned that you would do a rather tight line breeding with Halo. I am wondering what the COI is,which program you are using and how many generations you can/did input?
I am checking out different programs and wondering which is easiest and most accurate.
Thanks,
Francine
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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pixie bee
MH
Posts:4476
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| 06/19/2009 8:30 AM |
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I don't see any,maybe I am not looking hard enough, CH dogs who are the result of line/in breeding. I don't see it here or in europe. It seems the best and quickest way to breed a CH is to outcross.
The breeders I see doing line/in breeding are the breeders who want to (attempt) completely fix a fault/shortcoming in the line and who want to keep certain homozygosity of the line. This does require many,many generations of dedicated, hard work and the ability to
recognize faults quickly in a litter.
The breed can and will do well without this type of breeding, are there breeders here or breeders anyone knows of that see a strong enough benifit in this type of breeding to want to do it? Would it be to strengthen a line or produce champions,bench/field?
Francine |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
MH
Posts:7925
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| 06/19/2009 10:08 AM |
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In my case there are some things I do not want to dilute like Halo's very dark eyes, her disposition, her drive, her very nice coat, etc. To your other question, I am not quite there yet. I still am doing research. Remember I just (within the last couple weeks) finally wrestled this within myself to a decision. Since then I have been talking allot with two breeder friends about what I want out of a breeding. I will probably only breed her once if I get what I want, but in any case it would be no more than twice. Now that I have a picture of what I want, I have started considering males (I have really narrowed it down to a couple), and one happens to be very close to me (about 40 minutes away). So, I am currently looking at the one that is closest. My next step is to go visit and see him in person and at home. He met the other requirements with health and he is a CH, MH and has some FT wins. If I still like him after I get to meet him, then I will look at the other areas you mentioned. This is just my way and may be backwards to what others do, but for me meeting the dog is my highest criteria and liking him is my most important factor.
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Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)
Yellow Rose GSPs
   
"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato |
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singltrak
Las Cruces, NM
MH
Posts:1149
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| 06/19/2009 11:37 AM |
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Bev,
I would also look at what the prospective sire has produced up to this point. Has he been bred before, what were those temperaments like, etc? Have you seen any of the pups, etc.
I know you are not looking specifically for structure and soundness traits but does this dog bring to the party what you may want to fix in Halo ? Just some thoughts as I look at prospective sires for Hailey for the fall and look at some different bloodlines and their possibilities.
Phyllis |
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Look to the Past, Breed for the Future |
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snips
n.ga.
MH
Posts:413
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| 06/19/2009 1:35 PM |
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Whew, just looked at the pedigree...I know who I would breed to |
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brenda |
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pixie bee
MH
Posts:4476
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| 06/19/2009 1:36 PM |
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In regards to the qualities you want to keep,disposition is passed to the pups by the mother during the time in the whelping box,at least I think so, and I don't consider dispostion to be a full definition of temperment. A friendly dog is nice but the dog better be sound as well.
Are you talking about coat pattern/color or hair texture?
I am a nut for drive,high drive. But drive for what? I know some dogs who have a high drive for digging holes in 100% humidity.Not the kind of drive I look for but yet the dogs are driven.
The best advice I can give about finding a stud is see if he compliments your bitch conformation wise and SEE him hunt and move. I would not choose a stud based on titles or if I liked him. Seeing him hunt will tell you all about his drive, an empty field is a good place to determine drive,cooperation,nose and intelligence and I would look into his water abilities. A dog willing to stay out there searching for a bumper or ball until he finds it,w/o direction is a dog I would consider highly, same goes for on land.
Very exciting journey you have embarked on. Are you wanting to keep a puppy?
Francine
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
MH
Posts:7925
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snips
n.ga.
MH
Posts:413
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| 06/19/2009 2:10 PM |
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You guessed it. |
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brenda |
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bruns333
Central Ohio
MH
Posts:383
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| 06/25/2009 11:14 AM |
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Just a thought, take Halo to Fritz and then down the road take Ringo to a Halo/Fritz daughter and you would have a nice DC heavy litter. Nice website
Matt |
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Where temperament means performance
http://silverbulletshorthairs.com/
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=721 R.I.P Trego 6-1-03 to 10-13-10
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=941
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=3626 |
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
MH
Posts:7925
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pixie bee
MH
Posts:4476
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| 06/25/2009 1:18 PM |
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If I am lighting a fire I apologize.
In/line breeding is about knowing possible faults that could occur ,looking and waiting for them to pop up and then breeding them out of the line through continued in/line breeding. Not about breeding dogs with a lot of titles in the pedigree.
Francine |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
MH
Posts:7925
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| 06/25/2009 3:28 PM |
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Your not lighting a fire.
Only part of the equation (and a small part) are the titles themselves. These lines are very strong on both the performance (and in particular hunting) and the show sides, no known health issues, just really nice versatile dogs (it is not easy to put a DC on dogs either and I see the DC as an indicator of the lines versatility). I have been doing allot of research and digging and so far have found nothing that I am worried about. I still have allot more looking to do, and Fritz is only one dog I am looking at, but I do like that boy (and I am getting a first hand look at his get with Ringo). He is producing nice pups and has a good strong versatile and healthy line behind him that meshes nicely with Halo. The initial cross in the lines is two generations back with Odyssey's Saint Blitz meaning this would be a granddaughter to grandson breeding. For Halo this is the sires side of her pedigree and she strongly takes after her sire. I like that side of her pedigree and would prefer to keep it solid which is one reason I am looking to line breed on the sire's side of the pedigree.
By the way, line breeding is not just about breeding faults out, but also about not diluting the good qualities in the line or strengthening those same good qualities. So, the thought by some is that a breeding program starts with a line breeding that strengthens the good qualities in the dam and at some point you might want to outcross for a very specific weakness. In this case Fritz actually is a good choice as he does bring to the breeding the one thing where Halo falls a bit short and that is with her chest, and he does not detract from her strong points in any way. So, it is a very strong match. JMHO |
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Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)
Yellow Rose GSPs
"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato |
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snips
n.ga.
MH
Posts:413
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| 06/25/2009 3:30 PM |
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Well....If you have a very good linebreeding, and those dogs just happen to be one of the most titled dogs out that has desire, talent, versatility, looks, ect...then it might be a good idea (I am not slanted am I) ? |
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brenda |
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
MH
Posts:7925
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| 06/25/2009 3:37 PM |
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| To answer you initial question I have gone 6 generations back for now and the COI for a Fritz/Halo breeding is .031 which is pretty low. |
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Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)
Yellow Rose GSPs
"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato |
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
MH
Posts:7925
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snips
n.ga.
MH
Posts:413
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| 06/25/2009 3:46 PM |
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So far, right here. We usually head to ND to hunt, but Rick has a litter planned late, so that would keep us here awhile. (course, I could go ) |
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brenda |
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Almost Heaven GSP
Springfield, WV
MH
Posts:732
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| 06/26/2009 10:27 PM |
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Posted By Texas Belle on 06/25/2009 11:36 AM
Matt -
Great minds think alike. 
 I'm not saying anything.
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Money will buy a fine dog, but only kindness will make him wag his tail.
Bruce Shaffer
Almost Heaven GSP's
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