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pixie beeUser is Offline

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01/20/2009 2:05 PM  

Hey guys,

on another forum,kurzhaar.us, there is a discussion about white nails. From what I have seen in dogs with white nails is that they are more easily broken or splintered then the dark nails.

Anyone notice this?

Francine



"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
MegCUser is Offline
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01/20/2009 2:35 PM  
It's been a long held belief, but I think there's significantly more differences between individual's foot/nail durability than what we see w/ color. Example: ALL of Dulcie's nails are harder than steel, and she's got one or two that are partially or entirely white. The other hounds have a mix of colors and Rogan is the hardest on feet/nails, although in fairness he's also a much bigger dog.

Mushers have long noticed that foot/nail toughness is hereditary, and it is something they actively breed for. If I were breeding GSPs I'd definitely put the trait in the 'pot of consideration' since it's obviously advantageous for a hunting dog.

Megan
+ Dulcie (Lehmschlog's The Right Spot) + Rogan (Lehmschlog's BR Rogan) + Anya (Lehmschlog's Anya O Conchobar)
Intro to harness sport/mushing- start here!
Bxr-LindaUser is Offline
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01/20/2009 2:37 PM  
Interesting. Never heard this.
My boxers all had white nails. Never a broken or split one. They were rough when clipped (but probably because of dull clippers).

Our GSP Bo has black nails, and one has already split.
carlower1User is Offline
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01/20/2009 2:49 PM  
I have never heard this. Nail strength is a combination of health, diet and genetics. My Shih tzus have both black and white nails.. her black nail is more likely to split than the white nail is. What I like about the white nail is I can see how far to cut as opposed to the black one.. I have never had a white nail turn into a bleeder.

Carrie
Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
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01/20/2009 3:11 PM  

Interesting.  I had never heard this before.  None of my gang has white nails and they are all tough.  Belle's in particular are big and tough.  I always thing of bear claws when I am trimming her nails.  The other two have much smaller nails.  Of course, they are also younger.


Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
pixie beeUser is Offline

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01/20/2009 3:14 PM  
So, if it is hereditary then that explains it all. Actually, the discussion started about breeding for tougher pads.The consensus was that it was impossible to do. Meg, you may want to go over to the site and give a little input.

Francine


"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
MegCUser is Offline
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01/20/2009 3:22 PM  
Posted By pixie bee on 01/20/2009 3:14 PM
...Meg, you may want to go over to the site and give a little input...

I have ZERO interest in getting involved in this arguement, lol. A quick dig through the archives on sleddogcentral should be sufficient proof, although they can certainly ask the question and get edjumacated quickly by folks much wiser and experienced than I!

Feet DO toughen up with proper diet and conditioning to a certain extent, but it's back to that ol' nature-vs-nurture thing... good care just can't reverse truely bad genes.


Megan
+ Dulcie (Lehmschlog's The Right Spot) + Rogan (Lehmschlog's BR Rogan) + Anya (Lehmschlog's Anya O Conchobar)
Intro to harness sport/mushing- start here!
pixie beeUser is Offline

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01/20/2009 3:27 PM  
I have never had a dog with a dark nail that broke or split. On the other hand, I know 2 dogs now,both sisters,which would confirm the hereditary view, that have on going problems with their solid white nails. The nails that are not pure white do not break or splinter. I have known other dogs over the years with similiar issues. Not that all white nails on every dog will be weak.


"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
MegCUser is Offline
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01/20/2009 3:38 PM  

And just to add another twist: there are certainly well gaited dogs with weak nails/feet, but if everything else is equal a dog that's 'light on it's feet' will simply pound their running gear less.

FWIW this white vs color foot thing has been around in horse circles as well. My observation is that a white pony hoof will almost always be tougher than a dark TB hoof. :)


Megan
+ Dulcie (Lehmschlog's The Right Spot) + Rogan (Lehmschlog's BR Rogan) + Anya (Lehmschlog's Anya O Conchobar)
Intro to harness sport/mushing- start here!
JunoUser is Offline
Sask, Canada
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01/20/2009 3:45 PM  

Juno's nails are all dark and appear to be very tough and have never broken or splintered. His dark nails do seem to grow at a record rate.

We do not clip as it is just a huge battle and as they are dark in colour it is easier to grind. Grinding seems to work well. We grind almost every other day and within 2 days the nails are clickin on the floor again. Granted we aren't grinding off too much at a time ((maybe 1/16 of an inch every couple of days) but it just seems like they are growing very quickly. I have always been going to paint to poor guys toenails some bright colour so that I could actually see how fast they are growing....maybe I will go and do that right now while I'm thinking of it.

pixie beeUser is Offline

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01/20/2009 4:15 PM  
My father has been a farrier for more then 60 years and he says white hooves are always much weaker. I guess this is one discussion that will never have an agreement.


"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
MegCUser is Offline
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01/20/2009 4:44 PM  

I actually asked a couple horse shoers that did our horses about the white vs other thing. They said there may be a difference, but it was swamped by the vast differences they'd observed between individuals.

And they were saying this as they put shoes on the cute little white hooved welsh/arab crosses who we put a brazillion miles on hauling kids down asphalt roads... they never came up lame, the nails always held well, and when the shoes came off there was usually just a bunch of clean holes and sufficient growth to put the next set of shoes on without hassle.

We had a handful of dark-hooved TBs that were not nearly so easy. The shoers would end up mixing quite a bit of some kind of pinkish expoxy 'bondo' to shore up their brittle hoof wall and working around the old set of nail holes was tough because the hoof grew so slowly. When shoes came off they often took hunks of the hoof wall with the nails, requiring more expoxy again the next time 'round. Needless to say, these horses required a lot more care to keep from laming up, especially if we were riding a lot of roads.


Megan
+ Dulcie (Lehmschlog's The Right Spot) + Rogan (Lehmschlog's BR Rogan) + Anya (Lehmschlog's Anya O Conchobar)
Intro to harness sport/mushing- start here!
TessaGAUser is Offline
Georgia
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01/20/2009 7:40 PM  
Only had white-nailed dogs (American Bulldogs) and none of them had broken nails. Tessa is my first black-nailed dog. I am learning how to keep it short, took some getting used to. She's only 7 months old so I can't say yet how prone she is to breaking nails.

To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
My creation
Kerplunk105User is Offline
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01/21/2009 7:09 AM  
Leena's nails are almost all white, except for a few black ones. My Labrador has black nails. Hers are very hard and have never split, (she's 9). Actually, come to think of it, none of my dogs nails have ever split or broke. I try to keep them as short as possible by weekly trimming.

Elizabeth
Leena RIP 11/08-9/17/09
Bliss, the Labrador
Tegan, the Weim/Labrador
pixie beeUser is Offline

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01/21/2009 7:58 AM  
You are right,nail length will have some bearing on how often any color nail breaks. I trim the nails once a week.
When I say that I find white nails to be weaker I am talking about dogs who do activities that would break nails,like digging,roading on rough terrain,ect. Not dogs out on a daily romp. I didn't want to suggest that I was referring to soft nails or nails that break just at looking at them. But when the going gets tough, it's the solid white nails I have found to be the weak ones.
Anyone have trouble with dew claws being left in?


"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
Kerplunk105User is Offline
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01/21/2009 8:42 AM  

My guys do mostly off-road running around, but sometimes we do walk on paved roads.

Both my GSP and the Lab (thankfully!!) had their declaws removed. My parents French Bulldog that they adopted has his. He has ripped them off several times running around. They try and keep them as trimmed as possible.


Elizabeth
Leena RIP 11/08-9/17/09
Bliss, the Labrador
Tegan, the Weim/Labrador
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