my pup points on visual how do ya all go about scent training this is all new to me please help she is retrieveing well and works good w/ finding down bird (dummy) want to start scent training soon      also trying to hold off as long as possible w e-collar thanx welder

welder - I have only done a little scent work with my girls, but have done a bit of reading on how to begin.  I found this article online and it does a pretty good job of explaining how to get started.

www.dogchannel.com/dog-activities/article_378.aspx

In addition, I would check into some of the books out there to teach your dog tracking.  Good luck.  I am sure there are others on this site that have more experience with scent tracking who will respond, but this should at least get you going in the right direction.

I don't have birds for ours, but I would 2nd what snips says, espically if your just hunting birds, our bonita has got a few song birds from around the feeders. Now she'll pass doves and pigions for the smaller song birds when out.

Scent training depends some-what on how versatile you want your dog.
Do you want scent for pointing upland birds,
or for finding cripped or dead doves and ducks in the reeds,
or for locating rabbits and treeing squarels,
or for tracking down your big game that didn't go down cleanly and got lost in brush?

there are books and articles covering each. and a single dog can do all. There is a point of dimenishing returns though. I try to mix up doing all these trainings, but our bonita is clearly not as good as she could be at any one, where if I focused on one thing or turned her over to a professional to just do one type of work.

Does anyone know were to buy live birds in St Louis, MO? How much they should be and ways to keep them in the city with out issues with neighbors?

That is a good link welder. You can also start in the house ie hiding treats and toys "out of site" and let the little bugger find them himself. I put quail scent on his toys just to get him used to the smell, and relate it to fun.  Just try to leave a tral sometimes, this will help with tracking. I also put pieces of hot dogs, but i don't like to rub them(the wife gets mad

N.D.

If you notice the article featured a Beagle, not a pointing dog and they were using treats, not game bird scent.  Pointing dogs need to understand game bird scent is a bird that will fly away when pressured, that is why they point. If the scent is on a tennis ball, then you are training your pup that scent is just lieing there to be grabbed, hence training your dog not to point.   Reason I am stressing this is because I have gotten dogs in here to train where the owners place scented dummies around the yd for pup to find and retrieve.,  These dogs literally have to be trained to point, as there is no natural point left in them.  Just a word of caution on using scents.  Using real quail or pigeons for pup to find are by far the best. If teaching tracking I will drag a bird then at the end of the track I will plant a good flying bird in order to keep pup pointing. It does not hurt for the pup to occasionally get a reward of a bird laying there, but keeping a pup sharp on there pointing is important, because if he ever quits thinking he has to point it opens up an entire new bag of problems.   unless you want a flusher

When we trained the late, great Kate, our first GSP, keeping her around live wild bird was key.  And on off season, we kept frozen wings, with the bottled scent, and I played hide and seek games with the wing around the house, kept her entertained and focused on bird all winter when we could not get outside alot.  She was so fun to watch "find bird" and tweek her skills in any way.  I will always miss my baby, till the day comes I can be with her again.  She's probably mousin' her brains out in heaven.  We always let her have some mousin time, before she got to business in the field.