I was recently asked about colors recognized in this breed..I know that the standard colors are solid liver,liver & white,white & liver,& roan & liver.....how about other rarer colors..can someone please email me a picture of one ....cypresspondretrievers@yahoo.com  thanks so much ..tracy

sorry, double posted....

Yes black does not occur as frequenty as liver, but that is only because most U.S. breeders won't breed to a black dog because of the DQ.  Black is actually the dominant gene for color, which is why you can get black puppies from a bitch who has no black in her background when bred to a black dog.  Also why you can;t get black from two liver dogs.

I don't encourage anyone to go out and by a black dog because they are "rare", they are not.  Get a dog that is right for the purpose you want a dog for and for heavens sake don't breed just to get "rare" colors.  I am not saying anyone who posted here does, I just encourage everyone not too.

Well, I have seen 1 tri-color GSP and one Weim colored GSP.

The Weim colored dog I saw was out of legit l/w parents, of good breeding.  It was strange tho, if looked at closely you could see a tinge of liver in the color.  If you did not look, you would swear it was a Weim.  The Tri I saw had tan tips on the face and down the legs.  I asked the guy if he would breed the dog and he said, why not?   I would'nt, but to each their own.  That dog was out of good bloodlines too.

The "silver" color that is rarely seen in the GSP is actually a double deluted Liver gene, hense the appearance of the liver cast to the coat.  It is possible to get this gene WITHOUT the "Weim in the wood pile".

oops I seen what I had to say was already discussed in another Post

can you delete a post on here once you submit it ? I can't figure out how to erase this Thats why I just edited it instead of erasing it

I'd have to look it up, but I believe Artus Sand's sister was tri-color with no further description. If anyone has a pedigree that goes back that far and doesn't have Artus Sand (and therefore the parents that threw tri) in it I'd be shocked. The German Standard allows for some variation in the roan colors. I've seen photos of European dogs that were more "brown" than "liver":

1. Solid liver.
2. Liver, with slight white or ticking on chest or toes.
3. Dark liver roan with liver head, liver patches or spots. The basic colour of this dog is neither liver with white or white with liver, but an intimate blend of the two colours, resulting in that unobtrusive appearance which is so valuable for practical purposes. The inside of the hind legs and the tip of the tail are often lighter in colour.
4. Light liver roan, liver head, liver patches or spots. This type of colouring has few liver hairs, with the white hair predominating, making the dog appear lighter overall.
5. White, liver head markings, liver patches or spots.
6. Black, in the same shades and variations as liver.
n.b. Slight tendency to sandy colour around the muzzle and feet is permissible ("Gelber Brand."

 Sorry, This is NOT a GSP !!!!

 

I have been following this discussion with interest, so I went back and did a little research.  Apparently there is a recessive gene allele that goes back to shorthairs in Germany and Denmark that could still be present in some of today's GSPs.  Here is an excerpt from Georgina Byrne's book about Tri-colored GSPs.

"Tricoloured dogs have certainly appeared in GSP litters. Two very famous and important sires, Artus Sand (Germany) and Bob Koge (Denmark) had close relatives described as "tricoloured" (Maxwell, 1965 and Burns, 1952). In Artus' case, it was his sister, Atta Sand, and in the case of Bob, both his sire, Hestehaven's Rap and an unnamed uncle were so coloured. Presumably, since the pattern is governed by a recessive gene allele there may still be GSPs carrying the gene.  If two such animals chanced to mate, then perfectly legitimate tricoloured pups could appear.  No doubt such pups would cause great consternation for their breeder, however."

So it is possible to get a tri-coloured GSP that is truly a GSP.  I would say it would not be desireable (not per standard) and would as Ms. Byrnes notes cause "consternation." If anyone is interested the section of the book on the history of coat color is good and easy to read. I would highly recommend it.  There are a couple of other books I have not yet had time to check out, but also have sections on coat color as well.

I believe Francois Bernier provide information regarding silver GSP's on the GSP-l a few years ago.  I don't remember the  whole scientific explanation, but I do recall that his research on the subject led him to conclude that Silver GSP's would go back to a weim grandparent (or another breed, I forget which), which might not be known by the owners of the parents.

If a person has a silver GSP pup, I would recommend them having the pup, parents and grandparents DNA'd in order to be sure this is not the case.