|
| Author |
Messages |
|
Ace1cappuccino
Carp Lake, Michigan
MH
Posts:1618
 |
| 02/05/2008 7:27 AM |
|
| I am looking for the super bird drive and as close to conformation as possible. I have seen these dogs that won't hunt, I have seen ones that will, and then I have seen some that live for it. I have 2 here that want the bird so bad they'll just about drool wanting to get it. That is the drive I want. Mocha will point where a grouse had roosted and lost a few feathers. I love it. Except I get all excited and then she realizes it's older scent and tracks more. I have a friend who bought a male gsp with(he said) the most crosses of Dixieland's luke that he could find. I guess that is good? I am just wondering how many times a dog being in the line would be too much. Don't want 2 headed pups or something. If you have a correct dog like Dixieland's rusty and he was in the sire's pedigree for 3 dogs(4 gen) and on the dames bitch for 3 dogs, would that be ok? I know with dogs like Rawhide's clown that there are two sides of those lines as far as temperment. I am lucky to have the mellow side. Just trying to learn this. |
|
Cornell's GSP'S- Mocha cappuccino, Lili Belle Lotte, Sir Leopold Vom Hunter 1, Lil Miss Lotte Doddi, Ace Hunter Twisted Mister(GSP'S)  
|
|
|
Trey
SW Iowa
MH
Posts:516
|
| 02/05/2008 7:45 AM |
|
correct dog like Dixieland's rusty
Depends on what you mean by correct? Winning FT, or anyother title doesn't really make a dog correct.
I have never heard of temperment problems with clown dogs. In fact I like the temperment of most ft dogs, they cull very hard for non dog agressive dogs, if they fight they get thrown out. And dogs that are hyper and leave the race on the chain or in the kennel don't do well in trials.
There is no magic number of what is too much. You will get more consistancy with line breeding, everything needs an outcross once in a while, you have to have your eyes open and outcross to complement what you have. And remember when you line you are doubleing up on the good and the bad, the breeder just has to realize what the 'bad' is. |
|
|
|
|
singltrak
Las Cruces, NM
MH
Posts:1071
|
| 02/05/2008 7:59 AM |
|
| and to double what Trey says on breeding for consistancy. Be sure you go into any very, very tight line breeding with your eyes wide open to both potential problems and all the good, glitz and glitter. Try to find out (if you can get the breeder to tell you and that may be hard) what problems have cropped up in the past. Realize that you may get trash along with your treasure. |
|
Look to the Past, Breed for the Future |
|
|
Ace1cappuccino
Carp Lake, Michigan
MH
Posts:1618
|
| 02/05/2008 9:07 AM |
|
I have heard from a few people that there is a crazy side to clown dogs. Hyper and hard to work with. Maybe it's the amount of time spent with them too. I spend more time with mine than my family it seems. Mine can turn it on and off when needed.
It's not looking like I am getting the pup I wanted anyways so I will have to prowl around to find another good line. I looked for a long time to find the lines this breeder had as I knew they were all fc/afc/nfc etc. Almost every dog in 5 gens was a champion. I figured that would bless me with one bad a## bird dog. |
|
Cornell's GSP'S- Mocha cappuccino, Lili Belle Lotte, Sir Leopold Vom Hunter 1, Lil Miss Lotte Doddi, Ace Hunter Twisted Mister(GSP'S)
|
|
|
krtennyson
Northern Virginia
MH
Posts:69
|
| 02/11/2008 12:22 PM |
|
Ace, what are you trying to improve upon in your current line? Disclaimer: I am not an experienced breeder, but I know this is one of the first questions that a breeder should ask. It isn't so much about finding a great dog to breed to, as it is finding a dog that improves upon what you already have, without introducing too many negatives. |
|
Opinions are like @ssholes, everyone has one.
Genuine dialogue benefits everyone, getting on your soapbox is a waste of everyone's time. |
|
|
pixie bee
MH
Posts:4123
|
| 02/11/2008 5:59 PM |
|
It isn't so much about finding a great dog to breed to, as it is finding a dog that improves upon what you already have, without introducing too many negatives.
How true this philosophy is.
Francine |
|
"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
|
|
|
Ace1cappuccino
Carp Lake, Michigan
MH
Posts:1618
|
| 02/11/2008 8:23 PM |
|
My male is about 60#, he is just a bit narrower in the chest than I like. I crossed him with my female Belle who is 45# and quite wide chested. We had 10 pups last year 5 and 5. 3 of the males are huge, brute stocky. Bigger than Hunter is and wide chested. They are 65# plus. The other 2 males are smaller like Hunter. All 5 females are wide chested and have just about 12 o clock tails. Nice legs and such. I am hoping to find a female that has better legs(taller maybe) with more hunting drive than Belle. She is good but not as much as my male.
The bloodline is full of champion hunters so I am hoping that the new pup (if I ever get her) will provide more consistent puppies. The bloodlines in the pup will be lot of Clown, and Gen. Norman etc.. I just wanted to see how much was too much crossing.
My other option was the Hege haus dog. I know that it's his grandparents but I was hoping the male crossed with Belle would produce some awesome pups. He is about 65#, huge wide chest, straight up tail, and stylish points (all of them do) but I wasn't sure how much of the father is passed onto the pups? I was thinking I could possibly keep a female from that litter to cross with my male. I was really wanting a phenominal bloodline though for my new female. |
|
Cornell's GSP'S- Mocha cappuccino, Lili Belle Lotte, Sir Leopold Vom Hunter 1, Lil Miss Lotte Doddi, Ace Hunter Twisted Mister(GSP'S)
|
|
|
pixie bee
MH
Posts:4123
|
| 02/12/2008 5:31 AM |
|
quote:
My other option was the Hege haus dog. I know that it's his grandparents but I was hoping the male crossed with Belle would produce some awesome pups. He is about 65#, huge wide chest, straight up tail, and stylish points (all of them do)
I do not know if I reading this correctly.
Are you saying this dog has a "hugh wide chest" - like a bull dog or as in forechest?
The tail straight up is not in any German standard I know of.
And stylish point? - no, not all of them do. |
|
"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
|
|
|
krtennyson
Northern Virginia
MH
Posts:69
|
| 02/12/2008 7:23 AM |
|
"My male is about 60#, he is just a bit narrower in the chest than I like. I crossed him with my female Belle who is 45# and quite wide chested."
The GSP standard specifies: "The chest in general gives the impression of depth rather than breadth; for all that, it is in correct proportion to the other parts of the body. The chest reaches down to the elbows, the ribs forming the thorax show a rib spring and are not flat or slabsided; they are not perfectly round or barrel-shaped."
I am not sure a "wide" chest is as desirable as a deep chest, just something to consider.
"He is about 65#, huge wide chest, straight up tail, and stylish points (all of them do) but I wasn't sure how much of the father is passed onto the pups?"
An equal 50% of the father is passed to the pups, each parent contributes a chromosone to each chromosone pair. When you hear about a dog that really transfers their genetics down through a line, this is called "prepotency" and is due to careful, selective breeding to create pairs of desired genes, removing undesired genes (genes are carried on the chromosone pairs). |
|
Opinions are like @ssholes, everyone has one.
Genuine dialogue benefits everyone, getting on your soapbox is a waste of everyone's time. |
|
|
markj
Posts:17
|
| 02/12/2008 11:17 AM |
|
I have a Rusty line bred bitch now, she is one of the best hunters I ever owned. ALso had 2 double bred Gen Norman dogs, both finished at 10 months of age. Norman was sire of sire and dam in that litter.
Should have a narrow chest that is deep not a broad pointer type chest.
Clown was bred to so many females their problem that showed up were attributed to clown and not the dam. Hmmm I wonder why that was? Handler hunted wild pheas over clown in nebr, must have been a good dog. He has show CH in his get too, imagine that  too much internet gossip to do this breed justice, get out and see em run, that is how to evaluate a dog. |
|
|
|
|
singltrak
Las Cruces, NM
MH
Posts:1071
|
| 02/12/2008 12:59 PM |
|
Just because a dog is a FC, or a Show Ch doesn't mean it should be bred for more of the same...ideally, you want to breed to improve the breed.
12'o clock tails have no place in the GSP breed standard at all...period. End of story.
Phyllis and furtribe
www.singltrakshorthairs.com |
|
Look to the Past, Breed for the Future |
|
|
Ace1cappuccino
Carp Lake, Michigan
MH
Posts:1618
|
| 02/12/2008 7:42 PM |
|
This is what I meant with the tails
Maybe not 12 o clock but you can see what I meant. So I guess that if I am able to get this puppy it will prove to be a great hunter as all the CH in the line.
By wide chested I meant that my male Hunter you can put your hand between the front legs without it being tight. Both my females are a bit wider, like a hand and a half. I have seen alot of them like that. |
|
Cornell's GSP'S- Mocha cappuccino, Lili Belle Lotte, Sir Leopold Vom Hunter 1, Lil Miss Lotte Doddi, Ace Hunter Twisted Mister(GSP'S)
|
|
|
|
| You are not authorized to post a reply. |
|
|
|
ActiveForums 3.7
|
You must be logged in to use this module.
|