Thought I would post a thought/question/comment regarding our wonderful GSPs, and their insane, super-power smelling abilities.  This particular issue comes in the form of working with retrieving dummies (also called bumpers...).  I had read some articles recently on how a dog (specifically GSP) "sees" a field through its nose.  Kinda an interesting concept, really.  They are able to "smell" in stereo, determine humidity, etc... judge distances, and do all the things we do with our eyes - and more!

Anyways, I have been working retrieving drills with Sadie for some time, progressing through from piles, to patterns for casting.  Well, the time finally came to get rid of some of the early dummies (canvas ones I had used to teach her to "Hold", that had torn, and hence the weight had come out, and they were not "throwable" - at least to any distance over about a foot, or so).  So, I bought some new, plastic dummies in various colors.  Anyways, Sadie worked well with these over a couple of training sessions - marking visually well with individual marks, and simple pile patterns.

Yesterday, she had some real issues with her casting during a slightly more difficult pattern (I am at the beginning of working a modified double-T with her).  Her behavior was not what I had expected at all.  So, after thinking about the issue, I decided that the new bumpers may be to blame.  Today, I modified the pattern slightly.  Having 5 new, and 5 old bumpers, I put 5 piles of 2 out - each with an old and a new bumper.  Every time I would cast her to a pile, she would retrieve the old bumper first.  Just to be sure, I re-set the pattern with piles of all old, and different piles of all new bumpers.  Without fail, she repeated the issues casting to the piles with just new bumpers (would go near the location, but it wouldn't "pull her in" like it would with the old dummies).

I surmise that she had issues "casting" to piles she could not "see" properly through her sense of smell.  A little like saying, "why would I go there - there is a pile over here!".  It definately made me feel that she could "see" the piles with her nose (an amazing concept).  It also made me feel that maybe I should have a rotation with my dummies to cycle-in the new ones (rather than a wholesale change) to get her used to them.

I am wondering if anyone else out there has had such an issue - either with training, or (yikes, God forbid), field trials/hunt tests?  I can just imagine establishing good blind casting with known dummies, and having a dog struggle on a blind retrieve during a test due to a different smell with the dummy.

Anyways it was an amazing realization that was incredible to watch.

Hey Francine. I never mind questions. With Dobbs, I believe a "Modified" double-T has a third, center (back) line (see:  dobbsdogs.com/library/retrievers/rjpart7.html). I also know there are some differences between methods (as we have discussed before). Admittedly, my drills are probably as made-up as anything else (although, I have also found that there is nothing new under the sun). Anyways, as for mini T, and Single T, she does quite well. As for the double-T, I really don't have enough dummies to do any large piles (I mentioned I have 10 dummies now, I had 8 a couple of weeks ago). So, this is another reason my patterns may be a bit... modified. The pattern I like to run with her is more of an H pattern. I would describe the pattern (in terms of piles located by cast) as Left, right, back, back-left, and back-right. It is the middle 5-piles of the modified double T. Bumpers are about 20-30 yards from the center-line, with the back-bumper pile being 20 yards back from Left-&-Right piles, and the Back-Left-&-Back-Right piles being about 10-15 yards back from the Back-Left-&-Back-Right Bumper Piles (I still have it shortened a bit from Dobbs, but am progressing ).

The dog sees where I place every pile (and I am sure of it), although she is usually on "Sit" about 50 - 100 yards from where they are placed, although some-times I have her in the middle of the pattern (if I am re-setting it, I usually do the pattern twice, once at the beginning of the session, once at the end). I would not call these "blinds".

As to the colors, I have a Hodge-podge - 3 black/White (2 old, one new), 2 canvas, 2 white (new), 2 orange (new), and 1 dokken dead-fowl thrown in. we work in short-grass, so they are really visible (except the orange ones to the dog).

She hasn't had an issue "shopping" for some time. Today, I did notice some when the new and old bumpers were together. I corrected her for it (as I had done back toward the end of single force-to-pile work). Then she would just go to the old one (when there was one old and one new). She doesn't avoid the new bumpers (as in won't pick them up). Actually you can really tell that she can't see the orange bumper in the field - she walked past it a couple of times this morning, even on visual marks. I would cast her back to the spot (almost OVER it) then she scooped it up. There is the same momentum to retrieve old, and new dummies - I verified this with fun-bumpers, and single marks.

I do realize the point of casting is to not use the nose. I purposely work down-wind (as the books say) to accomplish this, but it is very calm in the mornings, and I guess the point of what I was saying is that apparently she IS using her nose, even though I thought she wouldn't be. I might try to run the pattern without dummies a couple of times, now that I know she is using her nose. She goes to where I cast her, so there is an understanding of direction, and going to where I tell her to go.

This morning, I focused more on the casting, and positions, rather than retrieving the dummy. I extended the pattern out a bit, and stopped Sadie before she reached the dummy, and rewarded her for casting correctly, and recalling. I also incorporated a LOT more casting into her basic field work (more as a change of location for the casting than anything else). She seemed a little confused casting without dummies, but she caught on quickly. I think this type of enforcement will be good to clear-up some things. I didn't focus a lot on it, but got the idea from Tom Dokken, who uses placeboards to train a dog to quarter (see link below).  I was just using it to re-inforce casting (for a bit) while doing a little field work.  I would then recall, reward, and send the dog off on a "Hunt" command.

Here's the link:  www.gundogsonline.com/video/hunting-dog-training/teaching-your-dog-quartering.htm

So, why the smelly dummies again?  Not trying to be argumentative, just trying to see your thoughts on this.  I agree - smelly is good, but they need to comply with the casts as well (and actually first...) for the drill purposes, then translate to hunting/retrieving.