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Subject: Puppy whining in the morning, scratching her crate all night. Oh! Sanity, where art thou?
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marliqueUser is Offline
Montreal, Qc, Canada

Posts:16


11/23/2009 9:15 AM  

Hi everyone!

First, sorry for the very long post, but I've been looking up several forum posts all over the net on this subject and have read several answers that I'm unsure of everywhere, so I just want to give as much background info as possible.

I'm new both to this forum and to dog ownership. I just recently got a lovely little female GSP pup and she's adorable! She's also amazingly quick to catch on - in about 2 weeks she knows to sit, stay and to come when called (okay, that last one is more once out of two times, we're not sure she knows her name yet). She even already prefers to pee outside, and hasn't had an accident in a week or so, even in her crate at night. Anyway, the point is, she's a quick learner. She was born Sept. 16th.

My problem is she whines every morning to get out of her cage, and sometimes at night when we put her in to sleep if she's feeling particularly awake. We are a little confused as to what to do. We don't want to train her to whine to get out of the cage, so we ignore her until she calms down, and only take her out then. But some mornings it can take up to an hour, and I hate to see my little Melli Beese's feeding schedule delayed so long.

I doubt it's separation anxiety, or else then it's in the last stages. She's very good with being in another room than us. Sometimes if we play fetch with her and she gets tired of running after the toy she will already take it to another room to chew it on her carpet. She sleeps through the night, and when she does whine before sleeping, it's only for a minute or two. She doesn't wake up in the middle of the night and whine. She does, however, scratch the bottom of her crate when she gets bored. She also scratches during the day, when the door to her crate is open. She just walks into her crate and starts scratching.

So, the solutions we've looked at and are unsure about:

1- I know we have to get her used to sleeping all night, so I was wondering if I should or shouldn't put toys in her crate. If I put any, I'm worried she will keep doing what she does now: sleep most of the day and play with them loudly at night. If I don't put any, she wakes up in the morning and wants attention.

2- Ignoring her whining so she doesn't learn that it works, which means sometimes she will tay in her crate much longer than she should, or get up earlier to take her outside, but then she whines anyway because we've gone back to sleep and she feels it's unfair that she's back in the crate. We want to make sure she sleeps 8 hour nights eventually as an adult but don't know how to gradually get her to do so.

3- I'm trying to tire her out during the day, but here again I hesitate. She's very young (about 9-10 weeks old) and so I don't want to over-exercise her and cause any joint problems. But then again, whenever I make her exercise, she just naps a while after and then gets up and she's ready to go again! I bring her to the dog park, on long walks, I even brought her in the countryside and walked her off leash because I knew she'd be too scared to leave us (and indeed she was following our everyfootstep). She gets lots of exercise, stimulation, socialization. Enough to tire any pup out. Still she doesn't make it through the night. And still I am worried that I am overworking her.

She's been whining every morning since we got her. And scratching at night. It's driving us crazy, it really is. Please, don't think I'm a bad owner or anything, I can handle the whining for some months still, but I just want to make sure I do the right things to make her snap out of it eventually, and not become one of those dogs that whine all their lives.

Thanks in advance for the help I know I'll find here! And a great day to all of you.

Mo

Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
MH
MH
Posts:7926


11/23/2009 9:28 AM  
You are a great owner as you are doing your homework and trying to do the right thing for your dog. So, 9 - 10 weeks is very young to be sleeping through the night. My guess is when she gets restless at night she has to pee, even if you took her out right before bed. So, I would get up and take her out and let her do her business and then right back to bed, no playing. When you put her back in the crate she may whine for a while, just ignore her and she will settle down. She will learn pretty quick that she is supposed to go back to bed. So, at night when you do get up and if she whines tell her to be quiet and wait. The moment she is quiet for a couple of seconds, then get her out.

I think if you get her out at night when she is restless, she might not have as big a problem in the morning. If she does and it is almost time to get up, go ahead and get up and start the morning routine. If it is a while before time to get up then repeat the same procedure as you did at night. In the morning you could put a Kong or something in the crate with her to keep her busy too (I wouldn't give her a toy at night though).

Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
pixie beeUser is Offline

MH
MH
Posts:4476


11/23/2009 9:41 AM  
I walk a puppy every 2 hours,even over night. The only real solution is to wait it out. In about 8-10 months it'll all be gone and forgotten and when you get your next dog you'll swear this one was sooo good as a puppy.

Francine


"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
marliqueUser is Offline
Montreal, Qc, Canada

Posts:16


11/24/2009 5:55 PM  

Thank you both for your great advice!

So we tried it yesterday night. I got my boyfriend up (good boyfriend, goooood boyfriend) at 4:30am to get her out to pee. She did whine for 5-10 minutes when she was put back in her crate in the middle of the night, but something tells me she'll grow out of it and understand it's sleepy time.

I'm also making a point of moving her to her crate when she's sleeping during the day, and not letting her play with her toys in her crate. I just take her out, put her on her out-of-the-cage carpet with her toys and close the crate. Then when she gets tired and starts to nap, I bring her to the crate and leave her in with the door open. I'm hoping in time she will learn to associate "crate = sleep" and "day carpet = play". If that doesn't stop the scratching at night, we *have* gotten a water bottle. Here's to hoping I won't have to use it.

Again, thanks so much for your great advice! I'll keep taking her out at night and post an update to let you know if it worked.

Now, to tackle the next problem: she eats her first 2 meals of the day but won't touch the third unless hand fed! I'll try making her work for it, i.e. timing an evening walk right before mealtime. If that doesn't work, I'll post a new thread.

A great week to all!

pixie beeUser is Offline

MH
MH
Posts:4476


11/24/2009 6:43 PM  
Maybe she doesn't need the 3rd meal?
Depending on the food you are givin maybe she gets all she needs in the other 2 meals?
You could maybe thin-out her other meals and make 3 meals out of it?



"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
marliqueUser is Offline
Montreal, Qc, Canada

Posts:16


11/24/2009 7:52 PM  
I was wondering about that, switching her to 2 meals. She's still young, almost 10 weeks old. Then again, I give her Royal Canin Puppy 32. She may well be getting all she needs from the other 2 meals, but later in the night I can see her sniffing around and eating the tidbits of dry food that lie on the floor where her empty bowl is...
johnniegoldfishUser is Offline


Posts:8


11/25/2009 12:56 PM  

 When my pup came home at 8 weeks, I placed a futon on the floor next to her crate and would occasionally put my hand near the front gate when she cried. I also said "quiet' and shhh. After five days I moved back to my bed and kept the crate about ten feet away not facing the bed and when she started to cry I reinforced the quiet and shhh. 

During the day when I needed to work I would start her out with a kong with 4-5 pieces of food and put a small amount of peanut butter on the rim of the kong. This kept her busy for quite a bit and then she settled down. By 11 weeks she readily goes to her crate and I still use the kong and "quiet" is rarely needed.

She is also fed 3x per day and sleeps through the night. At first she tried to get up and I gave in a few times, however i decided i was going to sleep until my usual 5:30 awake time and she has been fine.

 

Enjoy

Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
MH
MH
Posts:7926


11/25/2009 2:31 PM  
I wouldn't cut her down to 2 meals a day just yet. I would do what pixie suggested and feed less at meals 1 and 2 so when meal 3 is presented she is hungry. You may just need to cut down the amount you are feeding overall as well. Good luck!!

Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
marliqueUser is Offline
Montreal, Qc, Canada

Posts:16


11/29/2009 2:44 PM  
Hi again!

Alright, so the night time problem is solved! I have moved her crate back into my room. There is no whining, no scratching or anything. It's great! It's less great that we have to get up in the middle of the night every single night, but hey, that won't last long.

Also, for the meals, I have simply stopped giving her more food when she finishes her meals. At first, the vet recommended that I keep giving her food when she finishes her plate and still looks hungry. Instead of this, I am now monitoring how many times a day she leaves food in her plate. As long as she hasn't passed three whole days without ever leaving food in her plate at any one of her three daily meals, I will not give her more than 2/3 cups per meal. For the past three days, she hasn't completely "skipped" a meal. She's been less interested in some, but at least she always eats a part of it.

NOW.

The thing is, the whining problem isn't solved *altogether*. Whenever I leave during the day, even if only for a couple hours, as soon as I get back, I have a whining, howling puppy on my hands. I don't want to tend to her right away, because I don't want to reinforce the behaviour. Also, I've read it here and there that when you get home, you should ignore your dog for the first 10 minutes you're there.

I do want to bring her out so she can pee outside, get her meal, etc. But she can whine for half an hour or more, easily. We have never reinforced this behaviour by giving into her whining, not once. I have no idea if this will disappear over time if I keep ignoring her, or if I need to do something special. I know punitive measures don't work, and so far ignoring her isn't getting any results. What to do?

Thanks again guys!
Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
MH
MH
Posts:7926


11/29/2009 4:18 PM  
I wouldn't worry about the whining when you get home. Go into where her crate is (be sure you have a treat). Talk very softly to her and tell her settle or easy or quiet. The moment she is quiet for a second. Let her out and give her the treat, and take her out immediately. Slowly extend the time from when you get home until you go into where her crate is. She should pick up on the routine and eventually learn to wait for you to come and let her out. Just be patient, she is after all still a baby.

Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
marliqueUser is Offline
Montreal, Qc, Canada

Posts:16


12/09/2009 2:57 PM  
The whining is over with. It's like one day she was doing it, and the following day she wasn't. I guess she finally figured out that it wasn't getting her anywhere. Now she is calm as ever even when I put her in her crate in the middle of the day to do something inside the house (move boxes around, whatever). Before that, she would whine and whine, not wanting to be away from me, or thinking it's totally unfair that she had to be crated even though I was in the house. Now she's so chill about it, she sits and looks at me, but we never let her out unless she is calm and quiet. Maybe going to her crate when we came back home, shushing her and getting her calm and then taking her out helped her to understand what we want from her?

Thanks for all your advice!
Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
MH
MH
Posts:7926


12/09/2009 5:01 PM  
Glad things worked out for you!!

Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
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Forums > General > Training > Puppy whining in the morning, scratching her crate all night. Oh! Sanity, where art thou?



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