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Subject: Sit command?
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calhunterUser is Offline


Posts:7


07/14/2009 11:18 PM  

I have a now 14 week old pup. I got her from a very good breeder and she has a fantastic pedigree. She will be my bird dog no trials or anything like that. Now my question is why is my trainer telling me not to teach her to sit? He will be doing her gundog training next year but I asked him if there was anything I should not teach her while she is with me and he said no sit but gave me no detail asto why?

pixie beeUser is Offline

MH
MH
Posts:4448


07/15/2009 6:02 AM  
Sit is usually the default command. If the dog is confused or feels to much pressure sit is what they will do b/c we are always happy when they do it and they want to make us happy.
Your trainer is probably afraid that during whoa training your dog will sit when the pressure is applied. Rather than fix this possible issue he'd rather just not deal with it.
Whoa training is not pointing. If a dog sits on point the dog is either very unsure due to inbred temperment issues(desire would need to be built up in this type of dog) or the trainer was to harsh.

Francine


"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
MH
MH
Posts:7834


07/15/2009 9:58 AM  

I train sit with all my dogs as I show in obedience while also doing field work with some of my dogs. My dogs are also shown in the conformation ring. Both the conformation and field folks will always tell you not to teach sit as your dog will sit when you don't want them to for the reasons that pixie mentioned. So, if I listened to the conformation and field folks I would not also have an obedience champion. If you socialize your dog properly, train them well, and build their confidence then I know you can train sit and still have a dog that does fine in both conformation and field. Thankfully the guy I work with for field work agrees with me. If a dog is sitting because of pressure, then IMHO you are progressing the dog too fast in whatever venue. The dog is unsure and confused so they sit when you put pressure on them. My boy's reaction to pressure in the field is he comes back to the handler (and he was trained to sit from an early age). All that is telling me as a trainer is he is unsure of what he is being asked to do and I need to back up and slow down. Age and maturity also play a role in this game as well.

There was a dog last weekend in the conformation ring that is a field dog and has never been taught sit. I have seen her before and the first time in the conformation ring every time the handler slowed down the dog wanted to sit (remember I said this dog had never been taught sit). This dog was under allot of pressure in that conformation ring, and didn't know what was being asked of her. This weekend she was much better, but she still had a tendency to want to sit when the judge walked toward her for exam. The problem here is that this dog has never been trained to show in conformation. Someone just decided that she could walk into the the ring and be fine, and with some dogs you can do that, but with most a little training and preparation will prevent this kind of thing in the first place.

Another thing that I do is I have a different collar and leash for each thing I train. It is like changing your uniform for whatever sport you are competing in. My dogs know their uniforms and what they will be doing as soon as I get the collars out.


Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
TessaGAUser is Offline
Georgia
MH
MH
Posts:2387


07/29/2009 6:55 AM  
Interesting point about using "collar training" to your advantage!

Despite the same statement re sit vs. whoa that I have heard about I trained Tessa to sit first (it comes so naturally, and they pick it up so fast!) but also taught her the whoa which actually turned out to work better for her when I wanted her to hold in place, say, for a photo. She'd always wiggle out of a sit-stay but I swear the whoa was preprogrammed.

I tried to balance the two but when I started increasing the pressure on whoa (distractions etc) a few months ago I started using the whoa a lot more often than sit (actually, she now kinda knows when I want her to sit and just does it without me asking, like while she is watching me fix her food etc). So far I think she only "pressure"-sat once or twice during training (over the course of 10 months), and never in the field. But that could also be because I have not raised the bar very much yet. We'll see.

To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
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