I know we are having a very similar thread right now but I don't want to hijack it. So whatever is discussed under auwallace's thread I have read and will apply, however this is my situation:

Our recall, once 100% on check cord and 95% off leash, is slipping...badly. With each NAVHDA training day in the field (once a month), the recall fades away. There is no way I can leave her on a 30-ft check cord where we train - not enough range and vegetation is too dense (briars, thistles, brush piles etc), so there is no way to enforce a recall, but I still have to call and get her back sometimes e.g. when she is crossing into other fields to hunt up other people's birds etc.

Anyway, she now learned that I can't always make her come back, and she learned this very well.

Will go back to the check cord for practice but am now seriously contemplating the e-collar if for no other command than the recall. My questions:

1. What features are important on an e-collar (types of stimulation, levels, range etc.)?

2. Is the Tritronics book on how to e-collar train worth getting?  I have a general idea on how to go about it (use for reinforcing, not teaching, start with lowest level of stimulation, timing of correction, collar conditioning, etc) but have never used one and like the idea of an "extended manual".

I have owned two ecollars. The first I bought out of ignorance and with the need to break Halo of jumping on the window. That collar was the Innotek and it served its purpose, but had one feature missing that I later wanted and that was range. So, I did allot of research and also talked to allot of folks and the most recommended was the TriTronics. It has 9 levels of stimulation, is water proof (both the transmitter and receiver), has 1.5 mile range, is easy to charge, and I could buy an expandable set so I could add two more dogs for a total of 3 dogs on one controller. I bought the TriTronics Flyaway G3 EXP and I love it. I have not had any problems with it and just added another receiver (1 for Ringo and 1 for Halo) and it was super easy to add the new receiver. It does not have a warning beep, but frankly I want the warning to be my voice and then if they don't respond, zap. I don't want to call, warn with a beep and then zap. Just one too many commands IMHO.

As for the book, I would wait. If you buy an ecollar it should come with all the info you need to train with the collar. My TriTronics even had a nice CD with it. If I were going to buy anything and since you are training your dog to hunt, I would buy Perfect Start and Perfect Finish as they use the ecollar in their training.

I think if you get the ecollar you will be amazed at the quick turn around you have with Tessa. After the first time with the ecollar I have not really had to use them again. I keep the two around though as a gentle reminder for Halo and Ringo. They wear them when we go out hiking and I never use them beyond putting the collars on the dogs. It is a nice feeling of security. I had to laugh this weekend I took the dogs hiking and as we were finishing up the hike we ran into some folks with labs, and the first thing they said to me was TriTronics. Their dogs were wearing them too. We had a good laugh about how useful the collars are.

So I do it a little different because all I use if for is the recall and my dogs already know the command inside out.  I first let the dog wear the collar for several weeks with it not turned on at all.  This gets them used to the collar and associating it with fun stuff.  So, go for a walk, pull the collar out and put it on them. Go for a swim, same thing.  Bird training, pull out the collar and put it on them.  Feeding time, put the collar on.  Even just hanging out around the house, let them wear the collar.

So now they are conditioned to the collar.  I turn on the collar for the first time and put it on them.  Make sure it is tight enough or it won't work. The two prongs have to come in contact with the skin to work.  I also make sure it is up high on the neck just behind the ears.  I take them out and do some recalls on leash just to get them thinking about work and what they need to do (no stimulation yet).  Next I take off the leash.  Let them have some fun and when they are aways away I call them.  If they do not respond immediately I push and hold the stimulation button on the lowest setting and watch for a response.  If they do not respond I increase the stimulation still holding down the button.  As soon as I get a flicker of response I quit increasing the stimulation and as soon as they turn back to me I release the stimulation button.  This all sounds like it takes time, but it happens in a few seconds of time.  Usually you will get a response to stimulation on the 1 or 2 setting.  Sometimes they will kind of jerk and shake their head, somtimes it is more subtle like they will look back at you.  Now watch for them to turn back to you and as soon as they do release the stimulation button.  Timing is important here as you want them to associate coming back to you as the way to stop the stimulation.  After the first time you use the ecollar, the dog will sometimes be a little clingy, and want to hang with you.  Don't pamper them, just lots of praise for coming and then continue on with whatever activity you were doing.  I have never had to use the stimulation more than twice on my dogs. Halo reacted more to the stimulation and wanted to walk next to me for a while, but eventually she started ranging again.  As soon as she did, I called her and she came back. I think it was on the second outing that I had to use the stimulation again with Halo.  She is actually my most hard headed dog and it took more to get her recall, but when we did she became the most reliable of my dogs.  Ringo on the other hand, was not as effected by the collar.  He was more melodramatic when I used it on him as he jumped like a rabbit and yelped (he was on level 2).  As soon as he headed back to me, I released the stimulation and he too was good on his recall after that.  He did watch me more closely for a while, but now he ranges way out as does Halo.  They both respond as soon as I call them no matter where they are.  I have to be careful to be patient to let them get back to me as they are often out of sight and sometimes a good ways away.  They always come back though.

Let me know if you have any questions. 

I use a whistle for the recall when I am hiking.  Halo and Ringo are often out of site and sometimes I can't even hear them tromping through the brush and trees.  There have been times when I have blown the whistle and waited and it seemed like forever, but they always come back.  I sometimes wonder how far out they get when I can't see them.  Still, they come back.  Belle usually stays within eye sight of me.  Sometimes she goes with Halo, but these days she really prefers to be able to see me.  Belle is also come check on me if I stop.  Halo and Ringo circle back periodically and do what I call drvie bys to check on me, but they stay out for longer periods and check back less frequently. 

The only problem I have had witht he whistle was when I was doing the hunt tests and our bracemate used a whistle.  Ringo would always look back at me.  He eventually figured it out though that I was not whistling him and he was fine after that.

Now that's a scary thought. 

That is never my problem.  My dogs always catch on way before I do.  LOL 

Francine, I'd be interested in that thread.

She's been on ducks before, kinda participated in somebody else's live duck chase, and also retrieved a dead duck. No duck drag yet.