EncinoQuailDog
 JH Posts:20


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| 02/04/2009 10:03 AM |
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| Thanks for posting this. Its something I've been thinking about lately. Sofie (10 month old) has progressed well with her own natural instincts, and she'll fetch a downed bird if its a single and she sees it drop. Problem is half the time she sometimes drops the bird after bringing it about 10 feet, or sometimes just picks it up and then drops it to go look for more birds. So it seems I'm going to have to do the force fetch training so she'll be consistent. Great to have a guideline on what to do and what to expect. |
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 02/04/2009 6:26 PM |
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Well this dog is only one example of what you may expect. My GSP is learning very fast; my Brittany has been a work in progress for a good while now. One suggestion i would make is if and when you decide to FF your dog there is no backing back. Its gonna take time of you and its gonna piss you off and test your blood pressure and did i say piss you off? When you commit to it there is no turning back if you ever want it complete..gotta keep going until done. My dog(s) have had a few set backs but its to be expected, just gotta back track a bit and work through them. |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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pixie bee
 MH Posts:4450


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| 02/05/2009 6:46 AM |
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I highly recommend the SmartFetch DVD by Evan Graham. He transitions the process in easy steps for the dog (and trainer) to grasp AND he is available via forums to answer questions. I worked on the natural retrieve drive for 4.5 months. When I decided to go thru with the ear pinch method I pulled out his DVD and have kept in the DVD drive for a month now. |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 02/09/2009 10:56 AM |
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| Just need to update the sessions but Kilian is now fetching objects from 20 feet and returning to my side. Still have to command him to sit much of the time. Ear correction needed every few times as he will at times test me run to the object and sniff it but not return with it. More reps and more reps. |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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pixie bee
 MH Posts:4450


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| 02/09/2009 6:43 PM |
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By now he should be hitting the bumper really hard. If you plan on transitioning to the e-collar to replace the ear pinch, this may the time to introduce it. Have you done walking fetch and fetch-no-fetch? Which leads to pile drills. Francine |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 02/11/2009 6:32 AM |
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| Yeap he is on the bumper (and other objects) real good. We are on check cord and he is doing full retrieves and coming around to my left side, tak'n a seat and delivering. Every once and a bit he does not want to comply and he gets the pinch. Yea EC transition will be soon. |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 02/12/2009 6:18 AM |
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FF COMPLETE 2/12. Kilian has a complete understanding of the entire process. We will continue to work more reps each day with the addition of frozen birds and distraction. Water retrieves will begin when the water warms up likely May. By then he should be very solid!! Bit of a work process but much worth it!!!! |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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pixie bee
 MH Posts:4450


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| 02/12/2009 7:27 AM |
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FF is not complete until you have proofed it with cold blinds and shot birds. He may understand what fetch means but I feel you are still a ways away from completion,IMO. |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 02/12/2009 7:17 PM |
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Oh, i do agree; but the FF process of training him what "fetch" means....yea thats in his head. I should say the "work" part is done. To me now that i get to expose him to real world situations and such it becomes more fun.
We will continue to work drills in the yard and transition to the meadows by my place with distractions and then gunfire and other dogs and all the hoopla of hunting.
Im just stoked that he picked this up (and for me pretty quick). With 10 minute sessions. Also at his age and him being called a trash dog not worth buying by a good many guys on another board. Im so proud of this little turd thus far. |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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pixie bee
 MH Posts:4450


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| 02/12/2009 8:13 PM |
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Don't know how anyone can make that remark w/o seeing your dog work seems a bit presumpuous to me. Even if his pedigree is not a who's who paper only gets you to the plate, the dog still needs to perform and paper doesn't guarentee that. Still, I say you are fooling yourself in thinking your work is done. The hard part is now in front of you. This is where you as a trainer has to show the dog that you can make him perform and that it really isn't a game. He will test you at a distance, be sure of it. BTW, most any dog can be FF'd, doesn't make him worth it or not worth it. The proof of a good dog is in the performance in the field. Expose your dog to as many birds as you can and get that nose in tip-top shape and you will have a dog to really be proud of,on the other boards, that is. You shouldn't let others get to you. Francine |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 02/13/2009 5:50 AM |
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Yea, i understand there is a good deal of work still ahead of me. But to me the type of work is more enjoyable when it is more of a hunting type environment.
Yea i agree that paper or a pedigree is worth the .05 cents its printed on. I suppose i use the point of others as motivation.
Ill keep posting some progress of Kilian along the way. I have a photo diary started also. |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 03/02/2009 7:17 PM |
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Kilian and I continue to work small sessions in the house with odd items and outside on the weekends for extended sessions.
He will now bring a frozen bird or dummy back from a 30 yard toss 100% of the time without distraction.
In the house he has accomplished;
* Stapler, empty beer can, spray paint can, 4lb hand weight, boot, dummy, plastic bowl, large marker, my phone, even a apple.
Seems to understand what im asking of him 
Plan to add in some distractions of other dogs this week (well besides his companion my Brittany). |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 03/08/2009 7:36 AM |
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I have now been conditioning Kilian to stop on gunfire and await my command of either fetch or free. Began with my little cap gun and him on his CC. I would shoot it, toss the dummy and then command him fetch. Worked very good for a few sessions. Ive progressed to my .22 dummy launcher that has a louder gunfire sound. Still have him on the cc and near my side to ensure that he does not take off after the dummy. Will work on that more this week. He enjoys the long retrieves as the launcher shoots the dummy super darn far.... prob 50+ meters. |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 03/08/2009 7:37 AM |
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| Oh yea as for distractions, Kilian is doing good. In fact he pays little attention to anyone but me with others and other dogs around while training. |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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pixie bee
 MH Posts:4450


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| 03/09/2009 9:50 AM |
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Have you conditioned prior to gunfire to be steady for his own marks? When I teach steadiness to gunfire it is when we are just out and about, no pressure from objects or game. When I teach steadiness to marks it is under as little pressure as possible then increased when I see self control getting better. Sounds like you 2 are making progress. Feels good, don't it? |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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Rugergundog Saginaw Michigan USA
 MH Posts:395


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| 03/25/2009 6:19 PM |
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Well just a little update.
Kilian is now a nut for fetching.......he absolutely loves it! In fact his "play" retrieve command of, "Bring'it here" has also been raised to a new bar. Even when playing, "Bring it here" he must always place the object in my hand or no more play. It is remarkable how he understands the difference between work and play. Tennis balls he can bust after them as soon as i throw them. Dummies and birds and the addition of gunfire he knows to hold until, "fetch".
He is not fully 100% steady to shot just yet. I still need to correct him here and there. I will be working the steady to shot very intense the next whole week with him. Then will come the introduction of life exciting birds flushing. Plan to start with a Pigeon and work to ringnecks.
And then I hope we will be able to string it all together..........point us a bird, hold point. I flush.....he holds, I shoot, he holds (I hope i kill the bird) bird falls...he holds........i command fetch.........and he brings it to my left side.
Boy this is a long process....but i can not wait to see it in action! |
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Saginaw Michigan Brittany- Ruger GSP- Kilian |
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Erric
 MH Posts:95

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| 03/26/2009 11:00 AM |
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This is impressive, thanks for sharing. I'm curious about your dog and its background before this. -Kilian was 8 months old when you started this. What training had you done, not just on fetch, prior to the start of the FF process? -Did he get out at all during last bird season? -Where is he at on bird hunting training in relation to the FF training? Is he steady on birds? -Has this helped with general behavior and obedience? -Have you noticed any negative side-effects as a result of FF at 8 months? In retrospect would you have waited until the dog got older? -What was his natural retrieve like before the FF, have you noticed a change in intensity to retrieve as a reult of this process? |
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