I am a first time owner of a 6 1/2 month old GSP called Cleo. This is my first dog and on the whole she is great. We have finished an 8 week obedience class and she can do sit, down, stay, come, fetch and heal inside without a problem. She is also fully house trained and stays fine in her crate when we are away. However we have two problems; walking on a leash and jumping on people.

With a standard collar on she will just pull until she chokes. She gets distracted by everything when walking and just lunges out constantly. She always wants to walk in front and will not walk by my side. From the beginning, I tried the usual techniques i.e. stop as soon as she pulls, go in the opposite direction and use treats to make her heal. The only thing that worked remotely was the treats but she will only follow for 15 seconds and that is it. As soon as you praise her and give a treat she just lunges ahead again. I tried a gentle leader and this certainly reduced the amount of force she pulls with. However, it hasn't really stopped the pulling and I sense it is just an inconvenience to her and she hates having it put on. I really don't like the way it squeezes her nose near her eyes, even though it has been fitted correctly. When she gets home from a walk she runs around like crazy after I take the collar off. You can tell she gets really frustrated, which makes two of us!

In the mornings, I take her out for a run in the playing fields at the back of my house. I usually let her  off leash most of the time and throw a frisbee or ball. She will come on first call about 80% of the time. The only time I have a problem is if there is another dog or she is distracted by a squirrel. She has never run away  and most of the time she constantly checks to see where I am. She definitely burns off a lot more energy being off leash than walking or playing in the back yard. However, I wonder if giving her freedom is causing some the problems on walks?

Does anyone have any suggestions?

The other problem we have is jumping on people when they enter the house. I have checked some of the posts on this subject and will try the ignore technique and see if that works.

Although it is thought that a harness causes dogs to pull more, we have found that with our GSP it is the only thing that works. GSP generally don't respond well to negative reinforcement, personally I hate prong collars, I guess they do what they are designed to do, but to me they give the wrong impression to people who see you walking your dog.  We have found that Seven does not pull at all with the harness on...so give it a try and see if it works for your puppy.  

It works really well -- just like a horse harness. We are trying to wean him off it, but it certainly saved our arms and his neck this summer.

FYI -- Even the harness sometimes gives people the wrong impression -- we have had people cross the street when they see it (thinking it's a muzzle) .. if they only knew what a suck Bo really is :p

I feel your pain!

We have a 10 month old GSP who pulls and pulls and pulls like there's no tomorrow.  Like you, we did an obedience class, but no amount of treats or stopping in my tracks made a difference.  Around the 5th week, the instructor fitted Otto with a gentle leader and it was an absolute miracle.  For about two weeks.  He then started to lean into it more and more.  At the end, it didn't seem to help at all, but was successful at rubbing the hair off near his eyes.  Shortly thereafter, I dropped Otto off with our (field) trainer.  When I picked him up and we discussed next steps, I was told that Otto is a tough, tough dog and obedience will always be a challenge with him.  Our trainer said that he seemed to respect the pinch collar, but suggested I try the prong collar first as it was less expensive.  I expected instant results (I mean, it looks like it's from right out of the Spanish Inquisition), but instead found that Otto would lean right into that thing as well.  It gave me some breaks, but it wasn't a pleasant walk in the park either.  I'll now try the pinch collar and see how that goes. 

As far as the debate surrounding collars, I realize that they do look like medieval torture devices, but  I do not have an issue with them and here's why...  In my (much) younger years, I used to ride event horses (which involved galloping through the countryside and jumping fences).  My horses were my best friends and I didn't want to hurt them, so I refused to ride with anything but the biggest, fattest, kindest snaffle bit I could find.  I always rode on the edge of control because I abhored the idea of something mean and pokey in their mouths.  At one show, my horse was particularly on edge (storm rolling in and the bugs were bad).  When I corrected him on the cross country course, he took off and I had absolutely no breaks.  He stumbled, I hit my head on a rock (thank you hard hat), and was dragged a short distance.  I was hauled off in an ambulance.  Fortunately, my horse was just fine--though it could have ended badly.  So---to the point.  Any training tool used incorrectly can be abusive.  But when used appropriately, they are not only effective training tools, but they can protect both you and your four legged friend.  Lesson learned. 

I don't recall where I read the study, but walking a Darth Vadar dog on the end of  a buckle leash can do considerable damage.  Getting control over that situation not only makes the walks more pleasant, but it protects the health of your dog.  Do whatever you need to do to gain control over that situation.  If you're able to correct the issue with a gentler method--fantastic!  If not, move to the next option until you find a solution that works for you and your dog. 

With regard to off-leash running, Otto would be scaling the walls if he didn't get that time to really blow off some steam.  I'd say stick with it, but have Cleo drag a check cord so that if she ignores your command, you can reel her in immediately and remind her who's in charge.

Good luck with your girl!

First of all...the prong, or pinch collar, is not your be all end all solution.  It shouldn't be used exclusively, but can add a "power steering unit"  to your walking, and can completely solve the jumping up problem.  My first GSP was horrible about jumping on people when they came in the house, so off we went to obedience class with local dog obedience club. One of their oldest trainers, who has trained to OTCh (obedience trial champion) with several different breeds, took one look at him, and reached for her pinch collar. 

Pinch collars need to fit.   Not tightly, but just barely touching the neck evenly.  Then, we put on the regular training (metal choke) collar also.  That was his regular obedience collar...not a huge link, but large enough to not cut off circulation.  Initially we put the lead on the pinch (the round ring, not the other shield shaped one).  It needs to be a quick correction...pop and release.  Do not keep constant pressure and don't "haul in the tuna".  As soon as you pop and release...praise the dog.  Oh...what a good dog.  He will be, guaranteed.  Its as I said, a power steering unit....The reaction I got was, "oh...you wanted me to do THAT !  I see now! "

When you have done some heeling...and a quick correction...ie...Fred, heel and he does...then teach over, praise the dog and move the lead to the still ring on the regular collar...leave the other one on. and do the same thing...Fred, heel...   If he lunges forward, no praise and no discipline...put the lead back onto the pinch collar...  try it a couple more times and then go for a regular heeling session on the regular collar....always end on a positive note, even tho it may just be  Fred, breathe...oh, GOOD Dog!  

Guess you can tell  I'm for tossing all halters, gentle leaders and haltis out...hate them, hate them, hate them...what kind of control do you have ?  none...

Jumping up...same scenario...both collars.  You hold the lead and set the dog up...have someone walk up and you POP that dog down with the pinch collar...quick release and OFF ! at the same time.  Timing is everything.  Do it a couple times and then back to the regular collar...walk off and do a heeling pattern...then up to the person again...  Once again, end on a positive note and don't do this more than a couple times per session.  Main thing is that you walk on two legs and he walks on four.

Try this and see how it goes, and let us know...

Phyllis and furtribe

I don't want to hijack pstockley's thread, but should Cleo respond in the same way, any answers may be informative.

When I initially tried the prong collar with Otto, I assumed it would be a self-correcting tool.  He'd quickly realize there was a "comfort zone" and if he moved only within that zone, all would be well.  That was not the case.  I do pop him with the collar (absolutely agreed on the hauling comment), and for the faintest second he's in an appropriate place (though I think it's more of a momentum thing than a  conscious effort on his part), but before I  can praise him, he's up against the collar again.  I've never made it beyond "Good B--".  His reactions seem to suggest that the collar is just a minor annoyance.  Like a pesky fly.  Suggestions?

Well, we won't hijack then.  This may be useful and if not, there's always the delete button. 

I wonder if you are using the collar with enough links taken out of it to fit snugly, and I wonder if you have the big prongs or the mini-pinch collar.  I have a regular one, and especially with some of these big bull-necked boys (as is my Ziggy-65 pounds of solid muscle)  can take a lot and act like its a fly on their ear...     Try taking out a link in the collar, and try being ready to set your feet...pop that collar and say heel at the same time, step forward on the left foot, briskly...Fred, heel...step forward and stop.  He'll keep going since this collar thing is an annoyance and not really to be paid attention to.    If you take him off his feet the first time, the better.  Stranger things have happened.    A mini-pinch...teeny prongs... works really well, but I hate to say go buy one just to have around.

Remember, he's NOT a good boy, and its NOT okay if you just barely make an impression.  You need to be assertive.  It is for his own safety after all.  (makes me crazy to see little dogs specially being allowed to bark at everything and being told they are good boys and its okay.) I want mine to bark at strangers, and use the command, "that's enough" to reinforce that its okay to bark, but not forever.

Okay, back to non-hijack mode.

Phyllis and tribe

www.singltrakshorthairs.com

Thanks everyone for their replies. I think I will try a prong collar in conjuction with her normal collar. The harness sounds like it may reduce the amount of effort she can excert while pulling. However, I need to get her to understand who the boss is at some point. Like I say, she clearly thinks she is in charge and is taking me for a walk!

I will say that, while the Gentle Leader turned out to be a failure (as far as permanently correcting the pulling), it was still a Godsend nonetheless.  Before our obedience trainer fit him for the leader, Otto was at his most Satanic.  But using that tool during our walks for those few weeks seemed to really shift the balance of power.  Finally--the light bulb seemed to go off with him and the really troublesome issues ended.

I did take one more link out of our prong collar and that did seem to help.  My collar has the larger prongs.

This is Rocky's backpack, it even has a slot on top to carry an umbrella!!

I had both the jumping and pulling problems with my girls.  With the jumping I started working them from an early age and never let them jump.  I would put them in a sit and until they were calm no one could pet them or talk to them.  They quickly learned if they want attention they have to be sitting nicely.  My youngest forgets sometimes when family comes over for a visit.  I grab her and put here in a sit and tell her settle.  Again, no attention until she calms down, then lots of praise and attention.  You have to be consistent with this one and patient.  They will learn, but they also like to test you over and over again.  For me it was important to prevent the jumping as I was afraid they would hurt my mother who is older, and I didn't want them knocking her down.

With the heeling, first lots of reps and re-enforcement when they are in the right heel position.  Training the heel is the hardest thing to do.  They have to understand what is the right place.  So, reps and consistency and praise when in the right position.  Any time they are in the right position praise.  Wrong position, you correct them then lots of praise as soon as they are in the right position.  Also, after they know where they are supposed to be I found that a loose leash (meaning you aren't pulling on it and keeping the collar tight) worked best.  I corrected with my voice and body.  If you are sending the wrong signals they will respond.  I didn't believe this at first, but a very experienced trainer convinced me to try and sure enough they responded.  If I drop my shoulder back, they drop back. If I, indicate a right turn with my foot position, they move right. Same with turning left.   I also re-enforced commands like get in, back, easy, etc.  I started all this in a controlled environment and once they were 100% I moved outside.  I also have a command that I use when I want them to stop a behavior.  When they hear that they look at me and wait for the next command.  So, if they start forging ahead, I use my sound and tell them heel in a commanding voice (remember you are not asking them, you are telling them).  If they don' t respond I turn quickly and they get a good pop on the leash and collar.  You have to be consistent and repeat over and over.  As soon as they do it right lots of praise, then stop the lesson.  No drilling as GSPs get bored.   You can repeat the exercise later in the day.  The key here is consistency and patience. These dogs are smart and will catch on.

Heeling training never ends (at least I still train with both my 2 and 4 year old).  They constantly test me.  When I put a leash on to go out for a walk if they pull we turn around away from the door take a few steps then another about turn and the command heel.  If they start pulling again we repeat.  We do not go through the door with them pulling.  If it takes ten times we do that until I get the behavior I require. So, again consistency, persistence and patience.

The other thing you may want to do is work on focus where they are looking at you.  You are the center of the universe.  So, a good exercise for this is tell them watch and as soon as they do reward.  Gradually work on the length of time they watch before reward.  Also,  you can put them in a sit on leash and stand for a while.  As soon as they start looking around and not paying attention to you, turn and walk quickly the other way.  They soon learn to watch you as they will never know when you will move.

Now I can take both my girls together and they both heel on leash nicely.  It is so nice when in public as people marvel at how well behaved they are.

Good Luck!!

Bev and the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo)