Hogan
Wisconsin
MH
Posts:510
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| 02/16/2009 4:26 PM |
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I'm sure that many of you remember my OT post about our new pup. Our nonGSP pup.
3 months ago we picked up a new pup for my wife, a tiny Yorkie pup lap dog.
This morning he started having seizures. His mouth was just hanging open and he was drooling everywhere. His balance was off, and he acted like he could not see. He was running into the cupboards and falling over.
My wife took him to the vet and he seems to think that it is an issue with his liver and that he may need surgery. There is no vets in this area that can perform this surgery, so it looks like if we go through with this, he may have to go to UW Madison to have this done.
We are up in the air as to what we should do. This guy is so tiny (2.5 lbs) and from what we have found out, these toy dogs are prone to organ failure due to their size.
Our delema (sp.) is, as responsible dog owners how much do we spend on a dog to insure their health, and how much do we spend when we don't know if this is going to fix him?
We would appreciate any input.
Thanks,
Hogan aka. Gary |
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
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Posts:7835
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| 02/16/2009 4:36 PM |
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Gary -
I am so sorry about your pup. It is hard to deal with our pups when they are adults and sick, much harder when they are still puppies. As to your question, I have seen difficult surgeries go both ways, some successful and some not. Only you and your family can decide how you want to proceed, but I would certainly talk to the vets wherever they would do the surgery. They can give you a better understanding about what this means in the short term and long term for the puppy. What the odds are, etc. Ask lots of questions and voice your concerns to the vets. They can help guide you. Then listen to your heart and your brain.
Good luck! My thoughts and prayers are with you, your family and the pup. |
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Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)
Yellow Rose GSPs
   
"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato |
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TessaGA
Georgia
MH
Posts:2387
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| 02/16/2009 5:36 PM |
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That is a terrible situation. I've been through a similar one and my heart goes out to you.
The hardest part for me was to cope with the fact that there was no right decision. I had three options, and each one of them was the wrong in on way or another. While trying to make up my mind as to which evil to pick, people started picking on me, always a different set of friends depending on which way I leaned. Plus the input of 4 different vets. I was going in circles for weeks - worst time of my life because it was extremely frustrating.
Many factors need to be considered: the dog first and foremost. What is the procedure, recovery, prognosis? Will the dog need medication lifelong to deal with the condition, despite surgery? Will you be able to afford the surgery, the follow-ups, the cost of maintenance meds? What quality of life can they guarantee for the dog?
I ended up opting for euthanasia...it was hard, she was only 4 years old. And quite a few people really hated me for it. But the cost was really not doable for me, the prognosis guarded, the recovery long (up to one year), and the quality of life not what I envision for an active dog (how do you tell a young athletic, drivey dog that it now has to live on the couch?). It made no sense to me. Of course, putting her down, made even less sense, and I am still struggling with it although I still feel it was the right decision.
My best advice is, to look at every aspect, do a lot of research about the disease and prognosis, maybe find a Yorkie forum with people that have been through the process, also be honest to yourself about what you can afford financially, and go with your gut feeling. Do NOT decide this based on what other people say. Don't let anyone make you feel guilty.
Feel free to send me a personal message if you have questions. Will keep you in my thoughts.
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To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
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everbell
Kanata, ON
MH
Posts:3162
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| 02/16/2009 6:12 PM |
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Do NOT decide this based on what other people say. Don't let anyone make you feel guilty.
I agree. Only you and your family can make the best decision for all involved. You're in my thoughts at this difficult time. |
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Joce and Rich
Bogart and Shiraz (GSPs)
Roxane (RIP: 1995-2009) and Tiger Lily (Cats)
The Everbell Adventures |
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my2gsps
fredericksburg
Posts:9
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| 02/16/2009 7:15 PM |
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I am so sorry many hugs and prayers sent your way.You will make the right decision whatever you decide. |
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zimbass
MH
Posts:237
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| 02/16/2009 8:19 PM |
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| I dealt with a situation last year, I made sure I had as solid a diagnosis as they could offer with considerations with the dollar amont, then made my decisions. I made sure I asked how many of these cases they dealt with and success rates, knowing that my dog was not the first they had seen with his issues. I educated myself as much as possible on the internet. |
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http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=2095
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=2532
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MegC
Ellensburg, WA
MH
Posts:989
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| 02/16/2009 8:22 PM |
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Posted By TessaGA on 02/16/2009 5:36 PM
...how do you tell a young athletic, drivey dog that it now has to live on the couch?....
My best advice is, to look at every aspect, do a lot of research about the disease and prognosis, maybe find a Yorkie forum with people that have been through the process, also be honest to yourself about what you can afford financially, and go with your gut feeling. Do NOT decide this based on what other people say. Don't let anyone make you feel guilty....
*points above* What she said 1000%, especially about not letting people make you feel guilty.
And FWIW I SO totally know what you're saying in that heartbreaking statement about relegating a young athlete to the couch for the remainder of their lives. We had that exact same question when Anya broke her leg- the money was far less of an issue to us than what her quality of life post-recovery was going to be. People don't always understand that while we were glad to spend $1300 getting the dog glued back to full flight within months, I'd have a problem spending a fraction of that if it perminantly impared her ability to live the kind of life she really wanted/needed. |
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Megan
+ Dulcie (Lehmschlog's The Right Spot) + Rogan (Lehmschlog's BR Rogan) + Anya (Lehmschlog's Anya O Conchobar)
Intro to harness sport/mushing- start here! |
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TessaGA
Georgia
MH
Posts:2387
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| 02/16/2009 9:48 PM |
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The consensus out there seems to be that just because the vets can fix it - and they can fix a whole lot more these days than 10 years ago, albeit at a price - we have to fix it. Because we owe it to the dog. Whereas I feel that I owe my dog to make the best decision in its interest, and not in the interest of the vets, or my own selfish self (e.g. wanting to hang on to a dog at all cost - emotional and financial).
Milka's estimate was $ 7000 to fix both knees. That included to post-op follow ups but not additional surgeries should there be complications. I was told she will never run again, but they could get her walking...she'd still have bad days and good days...she'd be on Rimadyl...which in turn means regular bloodwork to check on the liver...she'd make a great house dog.
Which is fine when it's an older dog at the end of its natural life. But at 4 years old I thought that was crazy. All that money and rehab and medication just to have her aiive and breathing on my couch...that is selfish on my part. Because dogs are so great at adapting, people tried to tell me that I have a problem with having a crippled dog, whereas the dog itself has no problem with it. As I said, you can end up on the guilt trip really fast. Don't go there. You know your dog better than anybody else. Go from there. |
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To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
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Pointer Fan
Westminster, Colorado
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Posts:954
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| 02/16/2009 10:14 PM |
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I'm so sorry to hear about your Yorkie. It does not take long to get attached to our babies.
I had the same decision with my second GSP. It had distemper and severe immune problems. I spent a bundle on her and had 13 good years with her. At 13 she had a form of cancer that was considered treatable but because of her age and other problems and also health problems that I was having, I opted to euthanize her rather than put her through a painful series of treatments. It was a hard decision but one that I felt was fair to both of us.
I would check with the breeder to see if they could shed some light on the problem and prognosis. Whatever you decide know that your friends on the board are thinking about you.
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TessaGA
Georgia
MH
Posts:2387
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| 02/17/2009 7:42 AM |
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| I second that idea to contact the breeder for more insight on this kind of problem. |
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To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
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Almost Heaven GSP
Springfield, WV
MH
Posts:731
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| 02/17/2009 8:08 AM |
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Gary,
Is this a problem with the Liver Shunt not having closed? If so, the Vets should be able to readily give you a prognosis for the outcome/cost for surgery and from what I understand, success rates are very high with surgery to close the Liver Shunt. |
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Money will buy a fine dog, but only kindness will make him wag his tail.
Bruce Shaffer
Almost Heaven GSP's
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pixie bee
MH
Posts:4448
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| 02/17/2009 8:20 AM |
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I am sorry to hear about your yorkie.
When I was researching yorkies for a friend I could not find one breeder that offered any guarentee on health and there are several health issues with this breed. They know what they are breeding and breed anyway. Yorkies can cost from $700 - $4,000. The more expensve ones don't have health clearances they are the tea cup size.
I am not one to spend exorbantant amounts of money to fix pets. What goes thru my mind is - Am I really doing what's right for the dog or myself. Often times the money is spent and the dog dies anyway within 2 years, either of the same issues or others. Vets prey on good hearted,loving owners.
You can call the yorkie rescues and let them know where you bought the dog and possibly the breeder and they will flag the name(s).
Best of luck. |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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mit
Harleysville, PA
MH
Posts:599
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| 02/17/2009 8:21 AM |
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| You have been given a lot of sound advice so I will not add to that but know that you & your family are in my prayers. |
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TessaGA
Georgia
MH
Posts:2387
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| 02/17/2009 8:52 AM |
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I shall add, I immediately took out health insurance on Tessa and have a savings account going (my only one) specifically for vet expenses, so that the financial issue won't be an issue any more. It took me a while to "get it" and I now wholeheartedly recommend it.
Still doesn't mean I will keep my dog alive if I feel the quality of life is not there, or prognosis is bad, but there are many ailments and injuries that can come up that are completely fixable, and I don't ever wanna be in a situation where I can't make the dog right simply because I don't have the means.
I still haven't figured out what is harder, dealing with something like this at the end of the dog's long life, at the prime of its life, or as a puppy. I've been through all three and they equally suck. I wish you all the strength to deal with this situation, whatever the outcome. |
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To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
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Marie
Wisconsin
MH
Posts:2721
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| 02/17/2009 8:54 AM |
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| No matter what the decision and outcome, Gary, you and your Wife are deep in our prayers. |
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Marie and Rocky, a tall, high energy GSP
http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab18/Annette_Merryfield/100_0285.jpg?t=1287205231 |
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TessaGA
Georgia
MH
Posts:2387
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| 02/17/2009 9:45 AM |
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I don't know what tests your vet ran that made him conclude it's the liver, but here is a list of common Yorkie diseases, and hypoglycemia is another condition that could have caused the seizures; again, he may have ruled it out but for what it's worth, here is a link:
www.yorkieviews.com/healthfacts.htm#LIVER%20SHUNT
There is another site I often read up on, because I the vet's answers are very much in line with my own trusted vet's approach. The format has now changed and is kinda crazy, but here is a page re seizures...if you scroll down you can see people sending their questions, and his answers.
www.vetinfo.com/dogseizure.html
Hope it helps. Wouldn't that be nice if all you need to do is to fine-tune the pup's eating to fix this... |
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To live without dogs would mean accepting a form of blindness. [Thomas McGuane]
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carlower1
Kansas
MH
Posts:1253
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| 02/17/2009 9:56 AM |
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this is a very difficult decision... My prayers are with you and your wife during this time... Know that we will support you no matter what decision you make in regards to this
Carrie |
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Hogan
Wisconsin
MH
Posts:510
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| 02/17/2009 3:52 PM |
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Thanks so much for all of the kind responses.
Unfortunately we made the decision today to have Dukie put down.
Do to his liver not operating correctly, he had suffered nuerological damage. His sight was gone and he did not recognize us. When we picked him up all he could do was stare off into space and just barked.
This was a lesson hard learned.
As responsible GSP owners we have always done backround checks of the breeding, hunt testing, and conformation. ie hips tested.
Unfortunately we did not do this backround check on the Yorkies. Had we done this we would have realized that RESPONSIBLE BREEDERS do not breed for these tea cup sized dogs.
A hard lesson learned for all future dog purchases and breedings.
Please everyone, if you have thoughts of breeding your GSP, please makes sure that you are doing it to the breed standard!!!
Do not breed a blue gsp to a red gsp, so you can come up with a litter of purple gsp's, just because that is the new fad.
I think we all have a responsibility to the breed to, BREED THE BEST TO THE BEST.
Also, only pick your pup from responsible breeders.
If they will not allow you to come to their home to see the litter, BEWARE.
We sure enjoyed him for the short time that we had him.
r.i.p. Duke
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tucker
WAY NORTHERN MINNESOTA!
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Posts:599
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| 02/17/2009 3:58 PM |
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| So sorry to here about little Duke. Its so hard to lose them, but especially when its before there time. |
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Alice,
Ruger,
Tucker RIP 1995-2009,
& Gunner
'To love a dog that has been discarded by another proves to that dog that love really does exist.' -Christi Cooper
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MegC
Ellensburg, WA
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Posts:989
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