Radar had a nice time today. I took him out for an hour (first time that long since his injury). We went to the beach and visited with other dogs. He LOVED it. Then, as my husband walked him around the property to pee (b/c he got injured trying to jump the fence and it's icy and we can't dig another fence yet), he backed out of his collar (dh did not have the soft choke on him) and ran. There is no getting him back when he runs. He has to come back on his own terms. Trouble is: he backed out of his reflector collar. We left b/c our friend broke his leg and needed help and b/c Radar has gotten out 14 times since we got him and I will not let him rule the household schedule. We've booby trapped the yard, worked with a trainer, exercised him well and give him lots of affection/attention. I'm mad at the previous owners who listed him as a "lab mix" when they surrendered him to the pound, failing to point out that he is part GSP. I didn't know it'd be like this! No matter what I do to be proactive, it's in this dog's nature to run. The worst is that some neighbors (including the one who keeps his dogs in the yard or garage and doesn't exercise them or socialize them at all) tell me that he was barking to come in when I finally left after trying to get him back inside for over an hour. He said how I should be careful b/c he's black and people can't see him in the dark while driving (Duh! He backed out of his reflector collar!!) He said it like I'm a bad dog owner. I'm not. I am just a person who got a different dog than the rescue's description. Now I"m stuck with the situation and trying to make the best of it. It sucks b/c I"m willing to do the work, but it doesn't matter. I may as well do nothing. The result will still be the same. H'ell get hit by a car someday and I"ll have heartbroken kids.

I have to second lauralee.  She is dead on about these dogs.  I now have three GSPs and wouldn't trade them for any other dog.  They are the smartest dogs I have ever owned and trained.  My middle girl was a runner.  Every time I took her off leash the only thing I saw was her butt flying fast away from me.  So, I worked hard with the recall and when I knew she knew what I wanted we added the ecollar to the mix.  She is still my wild child, but no matter what is going on or where we are if I call her she flies back to me just as fast as she used to run away from me.  I had people tell me I would never train her to a reliable recall. They were wrong.  I guess what I am trying to say is if you really want to train your dog, then do it.  He will get it and even surprise you.  Spend time working with him and you will be surprised at the bond the two of you will have.  Give it a try, you might be surprised at what a nice dog he turns into.  And someday you may even be happy he has GSP in him.

Oh and lauralee was also right about us crazy in love with GSP owners on this forum. Just be careful you don't stomp too hard on our beloved breed as we are all pretty passionate about those goofy GSPs.

nobody's "stomping" on a particular breed. However, it is one thing to get a dog and fall in love with it and be promised his behavior is b/c he was in the pound for a year, only to find out that it is the nature of the breed that makes him run. Despite my best efforts, he runs. I do love this dog. Try not to be defensive. I simply have a lifestyle (two small kids and a husband who works two jobs) that doesn't allow me to leave the house and leave the kids behind to go after a dog or have neighbors treat me like a bad dog owner. I have time for the dog. I GIVE time to the dog. Constantly. I'm not a bad dog owner. The article "best way to ruin a dog" mentioned you need to research the breed you're getting to make sure it's a good fit. It doesn't say one breed is bad or good. It talks about "fit". So please keep this in mind before you bite my head off. Unfortunately, I think the prev. owner set him up for failure by purposely NOT mentioning this particular breed, for fear that he wouldn't get adopted due to their notorious running. And I think they  DID ruin this dog with abuse of an e collar. He's TERRIFIED of any small hand held electronics. He goes into a panic attack whenever I try to take a photo or video of my kids. I can't be sure, but the vet seems to think the e collar is the culprit. So, again, I"m stuck without a workable solution. And backlash for simply stating the truth. Thank you

Do you have access to a reputable obedience trainer? You sound totally overwhelmed. Any dog can be a "runner" even a Lab. I work the recall the most with all of my dogs and stress to my puppy buyers that it is the most improtant command that your dog should know and respond to. I think you need to go back to square 1, recalls in a confined space with huge rewards. Make it worth his while to come. Texas Belle posted a great strategy for teaching recalls on the forum. Do a search and find it. If you're not prepared to do this and talk about the dog getting run over by a car, maybe you should find him another home where he'll be safe!

Just my 2 cents,
Gail

Gail is right, you are overwhelmed and need some help to get over this.

One other point I have to make: being a GSP does typically hardwire a dog to need to run. It does NOT hardwire them to run AWAY. Two entirely different things. I have six shorthairs in the house (from the "dreaded" field trials lines) and yesterday the front door popped open in a strong wind. Four stayed put and enjoyed the breeze. Two meandered into the front yard and returned promptly when called. The reason I tell you this is to point out that your GSP mix has emotional baggage he's carrying and desperately needs training. Don't blame the breed, but rather his situation.

Jean

Desert Rose said it right, GSPs like to run, but are not necessarily going to run away from you.  Two of my three were off leash as puppies (6 to 8 months) and have never considered flight.  My middle girl as I posted in the previous post loved to run and would run away and I could not break her focus or get her back until she was ready to come back.  I was lucky enough to have a wonderful older shorthair that I could send to get her or I would have been tracking her all the time.  That was when I got really serious about recalls.  I hadn't had a runner like this in years (my last was a greyhound).  The only way I could break into her focus when she ran off leash was with the ecollar.  Even today when she runs for pleasure I use a whistle to recall her as she responds to that so much better than my voice.  I suspect the whistle is shrill enough that it breaks into her concentration better.

Here is the link to the write up that was referenced earlier:

www.shorthairs.net/GSPForum/tabid/220/forumid/7/tpage/2/view/Topic/postid/31746/Default.aspx

If as you say your dog is leary of electronic devices, you will have to do some preliminary conditioning before you ever use the collar.  While you are doing that you can also take the time to condition you dog to wearing the collar by just letting him wear it with it off. 

To condition to the hand held device.  I would start by setting it out somewhere near were you pup eats.  Just let it sit there until he ignores it.  Once he is ignoring it, I would start picking it up while he eats and just hold it.  He will eventually ignore in that scenario too.  Then pick it up while he is eating and move it around and walk around.  Slowly progress until he pays it no attention at all.  Now go outside with it and him and just hold it in one hand while you play ball or something.  He will eventually learn it does nothing and is always around when good stuff happens.  Just keep working in scenarios where he gets a positive reward (food, play, etc) while you are holding the device. Once he gets comfortable with it, and this may take some time so be patient and progress this slowly, then you can start work on your recall on leash.  Keep the ecollar on him and off, and continue to hold or carry the controller around your neck or on your belt.  You want the dog completely used to both the collar and controller long before you ever work off leash with the collar. In the link above I describe how to train the recall with the ecollar, so refer to that when you get ready to train the recall.  Just be sure your dog understands the recall on leash in a variety of environments before you progress to the ecollar training.  If done right you should only need to use the ecollar a few times.

Now this may sound a bit harsh, but it is not meant to be.  If you don't have the time to invest to fix this problem, you might want to seriously look into rehoming this dog.  To just let him run no matter how busy you are is doing a disservice to the dog, to your family who will be upset if something happens to him, and to your neighbors.  It only takes 10 or 15 minutes 2 to 3 times a day.  So, if you are serious about keeping this dog make the investment, believe me it is worth it.  This is something only you can decide, so good luck.

If you have questions, just ask as there are lots of folks willing to give very helpful advice, but please don't whine if you are not willing to invest the time in this dog to fix the problems. IMO GSPs do not have any more or different problems than other hunting breeds, except they seem to me (and I am partial) to be allot smarter than most.

Radar -  I did not say you were not investing time in this dog, but you do need to invest very specific time to fix the running problem.  IMO treats alone will not do it. IMO your current training method is not working. You need to take control of the situation and work 1) to resolve the fear of electronic devices, 2) make sure he has a solid recall (and knows what it means) in a controlled environment, and 3) then do something to break the cycle of running.  I agree chasing is not the answer as it is a game to the dog.  My dogs all love the chase game.  All that said, you do need to solve a problem.  I gave you some suggestions on how to do that and if you want to keep this dog then follow those suggestions or get you trainer to come up with a plan.  In any case, you need  to change something or you wouldn't be on this site "angry and frustrated." 

I apologize if anything I said was offensive, but I am truly trying to help you as I would love to see you succeed with this dog.