MOOSE1
Fruitport, MI
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Posts:1789
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| 12/18/2008 9:29 AM |
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I want to encourage all my fellow GSP people to join the GSPCA for the year of 2009 at least! Currently the AKC does not allow for black GSP's in the show ring. It is being put up to a vote in 2009 of all GSPCA members if black should now be allowed. I feel this would be a huge step for the GSP breed if the AKC would allow them in the show ring. That means a black GSP could go to show such as Westmeinster and such wich is something that has never been allowed before.
Here is their link:
http://www.gspca.org/ |
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Rajah-APBT- USUV UMJCH Flying High Rajah-TDI Certified
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Rumor-UMJ URO1 GRCH BNJ Rumor Has It-RN RD CGC NA II
www.ezydog.com |
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
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Posts:7846
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| 12/18/2008 9:40 AM |
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Moose - I have been a member of the GSPCA for (I think 4 years now). This has been up for vote numerous times in the last few years. I have always voted to allow black and black and white as I can see nothing wrong with those additional colors being allowed. After all the Germans allow them and that is where our dogs come from. I know there are others with strong opinions in the opposite direction, but I truly hope we get it passed this year. There are some gorgeous, black/black and white GSPs out there.
So, I will second Moose. Please join the GSPCA and vote. The GSPCA also does some other really good things for our breed from rescue to working to keep our dogs healthy with special initiatives. You will also receive the Shorthair Journal as part of your membership.
PS - I am only member of the GSPCA and don't have any other interests beyond how it may benefit our wonderful dogs. |
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Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)
Yellow Rose GSPs
   
"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato |
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MOOSE1
Fruitport, MI
MH
Posts:1789
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| 12/18/2008 9:48 AM |
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| I am exctied about being a member and getting the journal and such. I don't think many people realize that they can make a difference in the standard with this option though. I have heard great things regarding the networking of other GSP people that you get to know and meet through the GSPCA as well! |
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Rajah-APBT- USUV UMJCH Flying High Rajah-TDI Certified
Phoenix-GSP- USJCH UWP GRCH BNJ Shooters Rising Phoenix-CGC Tested
Cody- GSP- AKC/CKC CH UKC UWP GRCH Legacyk n Estate Sunray Minor FDJ CGC Tested
Tucson-UJJ CH Legacyk FlwrCrk The Old Peublo
Rumor-UMJ URO1 GRCH BNJ Rumor Has It-RN RD CGC NA II
www.ezydog.com |
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
MH
Posts:7846
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BEANS
Washington state
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Posts:1119
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| 12/18/2008 9:57 AM |
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I just went to the site to sign up
It states the membership is From January thru December....Do we need to wait until January, to get the 2009 membership ?
Renee' |
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Renee'
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MOOSE1
Fruitport, MI
MH
Posts:1789
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| 12/18/2008 10:02 AM |
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| I don't think so. I think when you click the pay 2009 dues that it automaticly starts you for Jan. 2009. I hope so at least! |
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Rajah-APBT- USUV UMJCH Flying High Rajah-TDI Certified
Phoenix-GSP- USJCH UWP GRCH BNJ Shooters Rising Phoenix-CGC Tested
Cody- GSP- AKC/CKC CH UKC UWP GRCH Legacyk n Estate Sunray Minor FDJ CGC Tested
Tucson-UJJ CH Legacyk FlwrCrk The Old Peublo
Rumor-UMJ URO1 GRCH BNJ Rumor Has It-RN RD CGC NA II
www.ezydog.com |
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
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Posts:7846
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singltrak
Las Cruces, NM
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Posts:1149
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| 12/18/2008 12:39 PM |
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Let's not get into allowing black into the standard, please. I know there are as many reasons pro as con, but as a breeder, I can tell you that the breed has many other problems which need to be addressed first before allowing in another unknown quantity.
Saying that the Germans allow them and therefore we should, or then they can be shown so that's why we should vote to allow black tells me nothing other than those two things.
Sorry, I do not intend to be argumentative, but I think you will find passions run quite high in making this decision.
But, by all means, membership in GSPCA is definitely the way to go to help in research and in betterment of the breed. Thank you for joining. (and rejoining)
Phyllis
Singltrak
www.singltrakshorthairs.net/ |
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Look to the Past, Breed for the Future |
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MOOSE1
Fruitport, MI
MH
Posts:1789
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| 12/18/2008 1:47 PM |
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I am not going to be argumentative either but once one really digs deap into what created the breed we know today black does play a role in it just as liver. I think it is very important to do the research before making a final decision but just because you as a breeder don't feel the need for it doesn't mean that the black GSP is any more less a GSP than your liver ones.
Once again not trying to start an argument but this breed is more than just the liver dogs. There are qualities to the black that can also improve the liver.
The black GSP is allowed. Just not in the show ring. If it is allowed in other activities and can earn the titles in other activities then the AKC has said that it is still a GSP. It isn't even a question on if they are registerable or not. Why even allow them to be registered if they can't be allowed in the show ring then?
I do agree there are more issues that need to be fixed which is another thread in and of itself and I would love to see that thread started to discuss these things in a civil manner but to say not to allow a black GSP in the show ring but that it is ok in the field and even registerable with AKC is obserd IMO. |
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Rajah-APBT- USUV UMJCH Flying High Rajah-TDI Certified
Phoenix-GSP- USJCH UWP GRCH BNJ Shooters Rising Phoenix-CGC Tested
Cody- GSP- AKC/CKC CH UKC UWP GRCH Legacyk n Estate Sunray Minor FDJ CGC Tested
Tucson-UJJ CH Legacyk FlwrCrk The Old Peublo
Rumor-UMJ URO1 GRCH BNJ Rumor Has It-RN RD CGC NA II
www.ezydog.com |
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MegC
Ellensburg, WA
MH
Posts:989
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| 12/18/2008 2:21 PM |
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I think allowing blacks in the show ring seems reasonable given the international/historical perspective, but to be honest if dog shows as we currently know them vaporized overnight I might actually be pleased (quickly ducks for cover from random flying objects launched by otherwise wonderful people).
So what other benefits are there for performance-oriented and/or non competitive peeps in joining? |
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Megan
+ Dulcie (Lehmschlog's The Right Spot) + Rogan (Lehmschlog's BR Rogan) + Anya (Lehmschlog's Anya O Conchobar)
Intro to harness sport/mushing- start here! |
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MOOSE1
Fruitport, MI
MH
Posts:1789
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| 12/18/2008 2:25 PM |
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I don't know yet! LOL. I am just excited to get GSP stuff in the mail a few times a year.  I wouldn't have any issue with dog shows as we see them no longer being in existance either. But at lass that won't happen any time soon. Plus the organization does a lot of rescue work stuff and helps promote that kind of thing. |
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Rajah-APBT- USUV UMJCH Flying High Rajah-TDI Certified
Phoenix-GSP- USJCH UWP GRCH BNJ Shooters Rising Phoenix-CGC Tested
Cody- GSP- AKC/CKC CH UKC UWP GRCH Legacyk n Estate Sunray Minor FDJ CGC Tested
Tucson-UJJ CH Legacyk FlwrCrk The Old Peublo
Rumor-UMJ URO1 GRCH BNJ Rumor Has It-RN RD CGC NA II
www.ezydog.com |
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escampbell
MH
Posts:213
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| 12/18/2008 2:52 PM |
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Megan and others:
There are many, many people who are members of the GSPCA who compete mostly in performance events. Over the years, this contingent has seen to it that the National Specialty show week now includes not only obedience, as it always did, but can and usually does include agility, rally, tracking, CGC tests, hunt tests. A combination of show and performance folks have developed Versatility awards, put togther wonderful slide shows, which can be viewed on the web site or at an event. The GSPCA has also sponsored a stand-alone agility trial and hunt tests.
The GSPCA also sponsors water retreiving tests and offers certificates for achievement at various levels. To earn a versatility award or a water test certificate or to be ranked in agility, obedience, field, you must be a member of the GSPCA
The GSPCA also has health clinics at its nationals and has a committee devoted to health issues. It sponsors a national rescue program, which helps local groups develop. GSPCA members do not all agree on everything. But, we all share a common interest and love of the breed.
On the black coat color issue: Beth, black GSPs are AKC registered because any purebred dog with a documented AKC pedigree can be registered. Many breeds have breed ring disqualifications. Lovely, show quality dogs can produce pups with DQ's. Reasons for DQ's range from coat color, height to problems with bites. But the fact they can be registered is not in and of itself a strong reason why they should be allowed in the show ring, as many dogs in many breeds can be registered but may now compete in the show ring. The coat color issue in this breed has been hotly debated for over ten years. You may wish to look at the list/message board archives. Pretty much everything has ben debated.
I will respectfully disagree that allowing black pigmented GSPs in the show ring would be venturing into the "unknown." But I will leave it at that for now.
But joining the GSPCA is good whatever your interest. Lost of great folks, interesting articles in the magazine and a stake in the breed's future.
Oh, the 2000 National Specialty show was in Washington state! It rotates around the country. As examples: 2004 was in Pennsylvania. 2006 was in Phoenix. 2007 was in Kentucky and 2008 was in Wisconsin. 2009 will be in Denver. 2010 will be in Florida. Again, the National specialty includes lots of performance events, seminars, parties. Most io us, when we fgo, take a vacation and have a blast!
Eleanor in NJ
who has an oversized Sheltie as well as two black and white GSPs - all DQ's! |
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Eleanor Campbell
New Jersey
Sydney, Presto, Price, Ozma and Soleil |
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MOOSE1
Fruitport, MI
MH
Posts:1789
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| 12/18/2008 3:37 PM |
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Thanks for letting us all know about the different kinds of activities the GSPCA is involved with. That is great to know. I know it sounds like I was basing my argument on just them being pure bred dogs. That is in fact not my reasoning for feeling they should be allowed. It was just a quick way while at work to voice a bit of my opinion. My true resoning behind it is due to the pure historical part of the GSP being black along with liver in color. But at lass I am not going to argue at all with anyone on here about whether black should or should not be allowed. I personaly will NEVER show in an AKC event unless the black GSP is allowed to compete as well. Just my personal prefrence. That too is a discussion for another thread.
To each their own! |
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Rajah-APBT- USUV UMJCH Flying High Rajah-TDI Certified
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Cody- GSP- AKC/CKC CH UKC UWP GRCH Legacyk n Estate Sunray Minor FDJ CGC Tested
Tucson-UJJ CH Legacyk FlwrCrk The Old Peublo
Rumor-UMJ URO1 GRCH BNJ Rumor Has It-RN RD CGC NA II
www.ezydog.com |
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pixie bee
MH
Posts:4452
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| 12/18/2008 3:45 PM |
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I doubt it will happen any time soon.
I see no reason to have them in the show ring. Altho, I have voted yes in years past. The color falls under the same standard and all breeders of b/w should adhere to the standard, but, as we all know, the standard is open to interpretation. So...
as long as most b/w breeders test and hunt their dogs the color is not so bad off.
A dog that can perform in the field, regardless of color, for hours and days at a time is built correctly.
After all the EP has no standard, Imagine that! |
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"Time with my dogs clears my mind, renews my faith, and lets me see the world as it is. My only regret loving dogs as I do, is the misery of their early departure." Robert G. Wehle
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MegC
Ellensburg, WA
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Posts:989
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| 12/18/2008 4:50 PM |
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Waitaminute.... I think EPs do have a standard, but perhaps most of them are registered with American Field instead? Heck, I don't know.
Anyway, beauty is as beauty does around here. Dulcie and Anya are both way below standard size so they're spayed (well, for that and other reasons) but they've lead my team for hundreds/thousands of miles, and they look like the prettiest dogs in the world when dragging my sorry butt back to the truck in fog or a whiteout! |
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Megan
+ Dulcie (Lehmschlog's The Right Spot) + Rogan (Lehmschlog's BR Rogan) + Anya (Lehmschlog's Anya O Conchobar)
Intro to harness sport/mushing- start here! |
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Texas Belle
Austin, TX
MH
Posts:7846
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Rugergundog
Saginaw Michigan USA
MH
Posts:395
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| 12/18/2008 7:06 PM |
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I am against black based purely on historical stand point. When the dog was derived black was not an intended color.
If my memory serves me correctly black was intoduced from another dog due to a limited gene pool in Europe after WWII, thus why Germany lets it fly. Yet across the pond (North America) the gene pool of the GSP (and others) was not affected so there was no need to scramble for genes.
I do think the black dogs are very beutiful and awesome; i just support the historical standpoint. Just as I feel the Brittany should have no black in the breed.....yet in Europe they allow it and AKC does not. |
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Saginaw Michigan
Brittany- Ruger
GSP- Kilian |
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Rugergundog
Saginaw Michigan USA
MH
Posts:395
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| 12/18/2008 7:11 PM |
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Oh yea i may be completely wrong......but that is because my eyes are tainted by my super cool looking (and best color of all) rather dark speckled bird sniffer super tail wag'n liver feather fetcher
Besides you all know deep inside the liver/white roan and patched GSP's are the best sniff'n, fastest, nicest, all around dogs anyhow. |
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Saginaw Michigan
Brittany- Ruger
GSP- Kilian |
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kshrthr1
Idaho
Posts:5
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| 12/18/2008 7:54 PM |
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Black is beautiful to me...but I'm a little biased.  |
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MOOSE1
Fruitport, MI
MH
Posts:1789
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| 12/19/2008 5:36 AM |
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Posted By Rugergundog on 12/18/2008 7:06 PM
I am against black based purely on historical stand point. When the dog was derived black was not an intended color.
If my memory serves me correctly black was intoduced from another dog due to a limited gene pool in Europe after WWII, thus why Germany lets it fly. Yet across the pond (North America) the gene pool of the GSP (and others) was not affected so there was no need to scramble for genes.
I do think the black dogs are very beutiful and awesome; i just support the historical standpoint. Just as I feel the Brittany should have no black in the breed.....yet in Europe they allow it and AKC does not.
That actualy was not the case. The reason black was introduced was because the Germans wanted to darken the pigment back up of their dogs as the eyes and coats were getting lighter and lighter from breeding liver to liver.
Here is a link to read over from Bruce's website that gives more in depth explenation of the black GSP.
http://www.almostheavengsps.netkennel.com/Content.asp?id=2490&mnuid=9414&HDR=The%20Black%20GSP-History%20and%20Origin |
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Rajah-APBT- USUV UMJCH Flying High Rajah-TDI Certified
Phoenix-GSP- USJCH UWP GRCH BNJ Shooters Rising Phoenix-CGC Tested
Cody- GSP- AKC/CKC CH UKC UWP GRCH Legacyk n Estate Sunray Minor FDJ CGC Tested
Tucson-UJJ CH Legacyk FlwrCrk The Old Peublo
Rumor-UMJ URO1 GRCH BNJ Rumor Has It-RN RD CGC NA II
www.ezydog.com |
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