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Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
MH
MH
Posts:7835


05/20/2008 10:47 AM  

everbell:  I would try salmon (just the cans you can buy in the store) or cod liver oil.  If it is just dry skin causing the problem, the extra fish oil should do the trick and they love it.  If is is more of a dermatitis I would see the vet (red itchy, hair falling out, etc). 

momsgspz:  Belle comes from a nice family that had an accidental breeding between their two GSPs.  The owner didn't know much about the breed standard and apparently neither did the vet he took the litter to for tail docking.  The vet not only docked the tails too short he got Belle's in the middle of one of the bones and it wouldn't heal properly.  My vet had a fit when he saw her and wanted to call the owner and reem him for butchering the dog.  In the end my vet had to do surgery again to fix the tail and get it to heal.  We did it at 6 months as we didn't want to put her under until she was 6 monts.  The vet took about a 1/2 in more off of the already short tail and it healed beautifully.  The short tail has never bothered Belle in the least and most folks that don't know the breed don't see anything wrong with it. 

I got Belle for a companion pet first and obedience dog too.  She is so laid back and sweet that I am planning on using her soon as a therapy dog.  She has what my husband and I refer to as an old soul.  Smartest dog I have ever owned.  We call her Perfect Belle because she learns so fast and never has to be corrected.


Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
parshalUser is Offline
Colorado
JH
JH
Posts:32


05/20/2008 10:53 AM  

I'm always hesitant to feed in the morning especially during hunting season.  The last thing I want to do is feed two cups of food and then run the dog hard all day.  Everything I've read regarding performance dogs says that they should run on an empty stomach.


Blackheart Abby Lane, UT 204
Intl CH VC Outlander Git 'R Done, MH, NA 110, UT 204, Inv 200
everbellUser is Offline
Kanata, ON
MH
MH
Posts:3164


05/20/2008 10:54 AM  
Posted By Texas Belle on 05/20/2008 10:47 AM

everbell:  I would try salmon (just the cans you can buy in the store) or cod liver oil.  If it is just dry skin causing the problem, the extra fish oil should do the trick and they love it.  If is is more of a dermatitis I would see the vet (red itchy, hair falling out, etc). 


Thanks Texas Belle ... my husband has canned salmon for lunch every day ... I'll ask him to give Bo a spoonful. (I'm pretty sure it's just dry skin ... we have the same problem with one of my cats.)


Joce and Rich
Bogart and Shiraz (GSPs)
Roxane (RIP: 1995-2009) and Tiger Lily (Cats)
The Everbell Adventures
see'n'spotsUser is Offline
north central Florida
MH
MH
Posts:334


05/20/2008 11:13 AM  
Sorry if I misread it. The implication "Bed" seemed to make is that "regulars are no loinger posting" b/c "Bed" thinks I "seem to know it all".

carlower1 wrote: "Bed was requesting your input because you do seem to know a lot about this breed. Knowledge that is respected and sought after, the request was not an insult or a slur."

Bedberg wrote: "Perhaps see'n'spots should indulge. He seems to know it all. I've noticed a few regulars are no loinger posting. Ooops this coment may be "off topic".....if someone doesn't ask if your dog is TOO skiny" then he is too fat"

Would also have to presume "Bed" might not have been overjoyed at my rejection of the "TOO skiny...too fat" thesis.
unowhoandwhyUser is Offline
Middleofnowhere, NH
MH
MH
Posts:1805


05/20/2008 11:37 AM  
everbelle, sardines are also good and the dogs adore them... just don't let them give you any doggy kisses right after they eat them! :D

Daniel Yankee Flyer - 8/2002
Lady Layla - 1/2006
everbellUser is Offline
Kanata, ON
MH
MH
Posts:3164


05/20/2008 12:31 PM  

Ewww! Bo loves to give me kisses after he's been chewing on his cow hooves ... as much as I want to encourage affection, that is just downright disgusting!


Joce and Rich
Bogart and Shiraz (GSPs)
Roxane (RIP: 1995-2009) and Tiger Lily (Cats)
The Everbell Adventures
unowhoandwhyUser is Offline
Middleofnowhere, NH
MH
MH
Posts:1805


05/20/2008 1:10 PM  
Oh, the cow hoof breath is nasty! I don't even like to touch the hooves once they get dog slobber on them. bllleeech!

Daniel Yankee Flyer - 8/2002
Lady Layla - 1/2006
see'n'spotsUser is Offline
north central Florida
MH
MH
Posts:334


05/20/2008 1:32 PM  
I also "adore" sardines. However sardines have become somewhat of a delicacy 'human food' item. A can, less than 4 oz, of traditional King Oscar sardines is $2.29 at Publix or ~$9/lb! The cheapest on their shelf is $1.19 (~$5/lb). Got sprats from Ukraine for $2/can. I've mostly stopped buying them b/c of high cost & recall buying them 4 for $1! I can buy fresh heads on jumbo shrimp for $7/lb! IMO a better, more economical, option for dogs are the fish oil capsules, 200 were $8. Old timers also "Feed" eggs to help dogs' coats.

unowhoandwhy wrote: "sardines are also good and the dogs adore them... just don't let them give you any doggy kisses right after they eat them!"

Dogs are notorious for licking their stuff, jamming their noses in other dogs' bidniz, greedily scarfing any kind of nasty bit they can find, as well as such pleasantries as licking at urine & raiding the cat box for Tootsie Rolls. If I were you I wouldn't worry too much about sardine "doggy kisses"! Insert "light-hearted" symbol here.

It might be purely irrational, but IMO there's something slightly immoral about feeding pets human food, especially luxury items. It tends to hit me during the news when they report on the world's food crisis. An old friend got me, after I'd looked at sardines & balked at the price, when he tossed down cans of King Oscar premium sardines for outside cats, who kill birds & small animals by the hundreds. The PO just ran a program to help feed people, where you put a canned/dry food item in your mailbox & the mailman returns it to the PO for distribution. Insert not so "light-hearted" symbol here.

Disclaimer: Not trying to be "contentious" or "debate" merely offering an alternative POV. Forgive me for sounding preachy. Better yet send the sardines to me or the PO. No GSP fans were injured in the submission of this post.

everbellUser is Offline
Kanata, ON
MH
MH
Posts:3164


05/20/2008 1:48 PM  
I hear what you're saying Spots, but my animals are my babies (only furkids in my house). I can afford to spoil them, so I do (to a degree: none of my pets get "dressed" up :P)). I also give generously (time and money) to our local food bank to help out those less fortunate than me. Trust me, I KNOW I've got it good, and thank god every day I was born in Canada.

Joce and Rich
Bogart and Shiraz (GSPs)
Roxane (RIP: 1995-2009) and Tiger Lily (Cats)
The Everbell Adventures
Texas BelleUser is Offline
Austin, TX
MH
MH
Posts:7835


05/20/2008 2:21 PM  

My husband and I are much like everbell in that our kids are our furkids.  My husband and I do not have kids of our own.  So, do we spoil our furkids, you betcha.  I have friends that want to come back as our pets (we also have two rescue cats and a rescue bird that we spoil too). That said, we do our part in contributing to food drives, cancer research, goodwill, salvation army, etc.  My personal feeling is life is short and happiness is a premium, so for me and my husband our joy is our dogs.  My two furkids got my family through a crisis in 2006 when my husband was diagnosed with at the time we thought terminal cancer.  But for those two furkids, I probably would have gone crazy.  There was many a night when they curled around me and helped me work through the emotions and tears. and laid in bed with my husband when he didn't feel good because of the treatments.  Thankfully, everything has turned out well for now.  So, yes we spoil them and they give back to us in full every day.


Bev Quarles, the Pointer Sisters (Belle and Halo), the Outlaw GSP (Johnny Ringo) and the little Princess (Fauna)

Yellow Rose GSPs

 photo FaunaBISJan20110001cropped_resized_zps96af44b6.jpg  photo DSC_0044_cropped_zps0a25f9ff.jpg  photo DSC_0030a_zps3c822a4a.jpg  photo DSC_0016cropped_zpsab533745.jpg

"A dog has the soul of a philosopher." - Plato
see'n'spotsUser is Offline
north central Florida
MH
MH
Posts:334


05/20/2008 2:32 PM  
What did they used to say? 'Now that we can feed the world-we must'? Never meant to imply anyone was not charitable, only that a dog 'in need' might be better served by alternates to sardines. $8 will buy 4 can of King Oscar, or 200 fish oil caps that "Feed" out for months. However I'm also an avid angler who is concerned about the overfishing & the rapid worldwide depletion of important food & forage species.

Keep in mind that many lesser brands aren't even sardines these days. They utilize the undersized herring that are caught & substitute. Also, practically none of the oil in the can is the highly recommended fish oil, but ordinary vegetable oil. Often rapeseed or soybean oil, premium brands use olive oil. Fish aren't exactly what dogs evolved eating. You'd accomplish much the same thing by adding a slug of vegetable oil to regular the "Feed".

Sorry, still working under the notion the thread is about resolving a "Feed" issue about maintaining weight, runny stools & fading coat, NOT how to "spoil them" w/pricey delicacies.
see'n'spotsUser is Offline
north central Florida
MH
MH
Posts:334


05/20/2008 3:00 PM  
TB, You're not suggesting that Kal is holding back & not "giving in full every day" b/c I eat the sardines myself?

At the Dog Park a majority of the dogs are clearly overweight b/c people "spoil them". In many cases the oversized & under exercised spoiling results in shortened life spans. I "spoil" Kal by regularly letting him run until his heart's content, taking him almost everywhere & allowing him on furniture. He's limited to tastes of human food. I'll resort to human foods if a dog is sick & its the only way to get food in them. Not sure what I'd be able to tempt them w/if they'd been getting human luxury foods all along. My Dad has spoiled his dog & has to put him on a diet now that he developed a limp. Lucky isn't feeling so lucky anymore since Dad stopped keeping his pocket full of treats.

Move over Paris, gonna have to "Feed" Fido lobster & caviar, he's lost self confidence.

My point was that, IMO fish oil capsules are more economical & better than the vegetable oil sardines are packed in.
everbellUser is Offline
Kanata, ON
MH
MH
Posts:3164


05/20/2008 5:36 PM  
Actually, Spots you are right -- apparently the obesity crisis that North America faces is also facing our pets. Killing them with kindness I guess.

Joce and Rich
Bogart and Shiraz (GSPs)
Roxane (RIP: 1995-2009) and Tiger Lily (Cats)
The Everbell Adventures
bravepointUser is Offline
North Gower, ON Canada
MH
MH
Posts:894


05/20/2008 6:11 PM  
Joce,

I give my girls mackerel. It's inexpensive, $1.19 for a soup can size at Food Basics. The bones and everything are there and man does it stink. They love it! I use 1/2 can between the 3 of them at supper time so a can lasts me 2 days.

Gail

Gail, Moka, Avery, Terra & Rayne
Bravepoint GSPs
momsgspzUser is Offline
Garden City, MI
MH
MH
Posts:174


05/20/2008 8:10 PM  

TB

Poor baby! Bad vet!!! She is very lucky to have you! As you are her! She sounds like such a cool dog! I had one of those who I just wanted to clone her personality! Enjoy the therapy work with her!


Hotwired GSPs...Breeding to standard and Beyond...
singltrakUser is Offline
Las Cruces, NM
MH
MH
Posts:1149


05/20/2008 8:58 PM  
Salmon, Mackerel, gee....my guys love it all....and ya know what, if you buy at Sam's or Costco, the price goes way down to affordable. While my almost 10 year old was recovering from a gastropexy and torsion, she got to eat Wellness Duck and Potato (and I don't think its merganser either) canned mixed in with well soaked food...oh well. :)

I did recently switch everyone off Breeder's Choice Chicken as I had bad coats, lots of blowing coat and weight loss too. We went back to Canidae and everyone looks a lot better, just in two weeks time. They do have a good breeder program also.

Phyllis and furtribe
www.singltrakshorthairs.net

Look to the Past, Breed for the Future
everbellUser is Offline
Kanata, ON
MH
MH
Posts:3164


05/21/2008 6:04 AM  
Posted By bravepoint on 05/20/2008 6:11 PM
Joce,

I give my girls mackerel. It's inexpensive, $1.19 for a soup can size at Food Basics. The bones and everything are there and man does it stink. They love it! I use 1/2 can between the 3 of them at supper time so a can lasts me 2 days.

Gail



Eww ... so now I'll have to suffer through Rich's salmon and Bo's mackeral. Actually, as you know, I'll do anything for my pup so this will probably make it into the rotation. There's an FB very close to use which we hit routinely, so we'll just toss a  couple cans of this into the basket. At least it's summer so I can feed him outside! (The smell is one of the reasons I have only ever given my animals dry food -- I remember the stuff we used to feed my parents cats. Yech!)


Joce and Rich
Bogart and Shiraz (GSPs)
Roxane (RIP: 1995-2009) and Tiger Lily (Cats)
The Everbell Adventures
singltrakUser is Offline
Las Cruces, NM
MH
MH
Posts:1149


05/21/2008 6:11 AM  
One excellent product out there is called Grizzly Salmon Oil. It can be found at Petsmarts or in most supply catalogs (PetEdge, Ryan's) and high end feed stores. Around $14 US for a very large bottle (around 22 OZ) it takes only one or two pumps on the dry food to produce the same results as the actual canned. Still has a fishy smell, but not to the extent as the canned fish products.

Phyllis and the furtribe
www.singltrakshorthairs.net

Look to the Past, Breed for the Future
bravepointUser is Offline
North Gower, ON Canada
MH
MH
Posts:894


05/21/2008 6:29 AM  
Joce,

Bo will thank you for it!! Moka starts drooling the minutes she sees the mackeral tin come out.

Gail

Gail, Moka, Avery, Terra & Rayne
Bravepoint GSPs
see'n'spotsUser is Offline
north central Florida
MH
MH
Posts:334


05/21/2008 1:35 PM  
I'd also reserve the canned salmon for human consumption. Try BumbleBee canned Atlantic Salmon for a human treat. Got to admit some of the canned mackerel is kind of nasty. Of course I'm spoiled by catching my own fresh Spanish & King mackerel to eat. Its excellent broiled & especially smoked. Looking for sardines I came across tiny mackerel, packed whole like sardines, from Morocco, that were outstanding. A lot of canned mackerel is Jack mackerel.

singltrak wrote: "Grizzly Salmon Oil....Around $14 US for a very large bottle (around 22 OZ) it takes only one or two pumps on the dry food to produce the same results as the actual canned"

Salmon is considered cold water fish, is linked to the best fish oils & is a common aquaculture product.

Jack mackerel is a warm water fish, is linked to high mercury content, especially in it's oil & is wild caught.

For those concerned about cost, odor, convenience & effectiveness "Grizzly Salmon Oil" sounds like a winner. The fish oil capsules I have blend as many as 5 fish oils together & I customarily puncture the capsule to squeeze out the oil, since Chip picked the caps out of his food. Need to remind myself to try & break the habit, Kal doesn't even leave the depleted cap behind.

Thanks singtrak, I'll look for "Grizzly" to take over when this bottle of capsules runs out.

For those still considering sardines, I'd suggest buying some packed in water & judging the fish oil content from the beads of oil found in these cans. Much canned fish is pressure cooked, a process that releases a large portion of the fish oil, oil that is drawn off for other products. Kind of like 2% milk, where the excess fat is diverted to butter & ice cream. Sardines packed in oil use vegetable oil.
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