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Subject: [working-gundog] Prey drive 2
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rospiganUser is Offline

MH
MH
Posts:372


11/25/2007 6:32 AM  
Don says in a private message he can read from the list but not answer to the list!
 
 
There is another thought in my mind about prey drive when I think of usually cooperative dogs like springers and border collies for ex. These dogs seem to have a good "social competence", so to say, and enjoy to play and work with anyone who they trust and who wants to have fun with them. This can best be seen with socially well trained dogs that are used to interact with people. For example they can directly accept to search for any object that in no way can resemble game, like a wooden stick with some human scent on it. Likewise they are just as happy to search for game, to hunt. They can have the same mental stamina like a good setter to search for game on empty ground, they will not give up since they know they might find something in the next bush. The actual motivation to work with stamina without a reward might be different from the setters. 
 
The difference to the setter is that many of the setters will do this with a minimum of support from its handler at a distance of a 1/4 or 1/2 mile or more. It keeps track of its handler and adjust its course to the handlers, yes, but most of the work is done independently. In this case we can say, without much doubt (since there is actually nothing more around the setter to mix things up than its own hope for a find), that it is only a strong prey drive that keeps the setter going on.
 
Spaniels are on the other hand a bit more complicated in their mentality. They are not only powered by prey drive but also by many other stimuli. As I mentioned they often really  like to interact with humans and this could be called a "drive" that keeps them going. They also have a lot of competition drive, in other words they like to work hard with their body like when chasing game in awfully thorny bushes or struggling with a wingshot duck in thick reed. Tug - of - war is their favourite game and you have often to be careful not to strengthen this mental characteristic by thoughtless training.
 
My theory is that such a dog does not need much actual inherited prey drive in order to work hard and with stamina on the field as a classic sporting gundog like a rough shooters dog. The combination of the pleasure to work with its handler and the pleasure of working hard with its body might compensate for a lack in inherited prey drive. An ignorant observer might think that this particular spaniel has a lot of inherited prey drive but that does not have to be the case, I believe. BTW prey drive is a characteristic that can be improved by positive training and a lot of it in the beginning could mean too much of it in the end, depending of other mental properties the dog happens to be in possession of.
 
With setters, hare-hounds, moose-hounds and other dogs that hunt with great stamina despite of little or no support from handler we can say that they have a strong prey drive that keeps them going. When we discuss dogs that work very close to us with constant support and interaction the powering force might be more complex to analyse.
 
Torsti
Borta Med Vindens Kennel
"Ask not what your dog can do for you.
Ask what you can do for your dog."
www.rospigan.net
lameduckUser is Offline

SH
SH
Posts:44


11/25/2007 8:55 AM  
I have an English Setter and an English pointer that I use to clean up after the retrievers are put up and we look for the escapes in a little wider circle.
 
If the setter is in the crate. I haul two dogs in each hole and I have 6. The setter will want to growl and fight with the pointer if you load him first and then try to add the pointer.. Load the pointer first and there is no issue when you put the setter in with him.
Now that I am out of the action there are three different people doing the pheasant hunts with my dogs. Two of which often have their personal dog which they add. They are duck guides as normal duty. Also the Pointer has been known to run off on his own. I have good control but I seldom ever let him out without a collar on him. THe other night they finished at almost dark and the guide started to load them backwards. In a panic he opened the door to let them out and start over and the pointer takes off. They call and call and blow a whistle for some 40 minutes and one of the guides gets in his truck to make a circle to see if he can see him and here he comes waging his tail carring a big ole cock. Just as proud as can be.
 
Ron
 
rospiganUser is Offline

MH
MH
Posts:372


11/25/2007 10:00 AM  
Hello Ron!
 
Nice to have you back at least behind the keyboard! Soon you will be back on the field also, a better, fitter man!
 
Torsti 
Borta Med Vindens Kennel
"Ask not what your dog can do for you.
Ask what you can do for your dog."
www.rospigan.net
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 4:48 PM
Subject: Re: [working-gundog] Prey drive 2

I have an English Setter and an English pointer that I use to clean up after the retrievers are put up and we look for the escapes in a little wider circle.
 
If the setter is in the crate. I haul two dogs in each hole and I have 6. The setter will want to growl and fight with the pointer if you load him first and then try to add the pointer.. Load the pointer first and there is no issue when you put the setter in with him.
Now that I am out of the action there are three different people doing the pheasant hunts with my dogs. Two of which often have their personal dog which they add. They are duck guides as normal duty. Also the Pointer has been known to run off on his own. I have good control but I seldom ever let him out without a collar on him. THe other night they finished at almost dark and the guide started to load them backwards. In a panic he opened the door to let them out and start over and the pointer takes off. They call and call and blow a whistle for some 40 minutes and one of the guides gets in his truck to make a circle to see if he can see him and here he comes waging his tail carring a big ole cock. Just as proud as can be.
 
Ron
 
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